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should archer get block astral?

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  • #46
    What Setsuna said pages ago is correct.

    GA10 cuts their crit rate in half. If your attack has a 50% chance to crit, now it will be 25%. Basically, they will crit you half as much "as they should have".

    Why is this good? Take your silly crit mage/knight who only has 4k crit at L80. That's probably 30% chance to crit? Knock that down to 15%. Went from 1/3 hits being crit to 1/7. That reduces damage taken by a lot. Now, obviously you hope this procs on the slyph delphic. Taking 90k to the face really hurts. Taking 40k to the face from a delphic is pretty damn weak.

    As for why deflect is so good. The damage calculation is not how you expect. Once you get deflect up to 5 or so, you will deflect back about the full damage you take. Higher levels let you deflect more damage than you take. I have hit a mage with L7 deflect with a 33k ap. He deflect back 44k dmg at me. Yeah, doesn't that suck?

    Another "bonus point" to why deflect is good is that deflect wins go to the tie. Let's say your opponent's slyph delphic (at 50%) hits you for 120k, completely kills you. But your deflect procs and hits them for 75k. They also die. You get the win. Deflect wins double KOs.

    Illusion is great in PvE situations. So the chance to take 1 damage is pretty damn good in necro and spire. In PvP, it's still good, but...I personally believe that dealing more damage is more important than taking less. Would you rather take 1 dmg from an attack, or deal back 50k (and not just a 50k, but a tie-breaking 50k)?

    Now for block...block is great (until penetration stat comes out). It procs frequently, much much much much much more frequently than illusion or deflect. And it reduces damage by 30%, same as if IS or Apollo was up. That's pretty nice. I prefer the semi-reliable damage reduction that block offers instead of the somewhat rare (but more powerful) damage reduction that illusion offers. You don't need an amazingly high block stat to get a decent block rate. I'm still shy of 3k block and it procs a lot. I don't count so I'm not going to pull a figure out of my ***.

    Once penetration comes out, I expect most everyone will be wearing deflect. The last slot will probably be split half and half GA and illusion with a strange few who wear HP.

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    • #47
      Apart from boosting BR i don't see the logic of people who use HP astral...

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      • #48
        Originally posted by MrPunkinHead View Post
        He wasn't implying that at all...
        If you actually read his posts he stated there was a chance to reduce the critical rate by x% amount.

        Also 40% reduction of 50 would be 30. L2Fraction.
        He's saying that the description being used would imply that there is a trigger for the astral to work. So there's a chance to reduce an opponent's critical rate by 40%.
        This is what he wrote:
        CHANCE of recieving crit reduced by -x%(amount)"
        1) Do you see the word "rate" here ? When i had read this, I thought about receiving reduced crit (dmg).

        2) ofc 40% reduction of 50 is 30. Just my stupid and funny mistake ).

        3) The descirption implies like that, if you read it like him (about dmg). Actually its more like thos:
        Chance ( possibility for your enemy) to hit critical dmg onto your char is reduced by x%.


        Im not going to take part in this discussion anymore - i simply know that most ppl uses block and hp and other similar astral just to increase their BR.
        I've tested it, and I noticed that most of critical knights and wizzards r simply saying in huge troubles facing GA astral user.
        As long as not many ppl uses that astral , its advantage for me. Im using atm GA lvl 7 as 7th astral, and it works great.
        My next astral will be ofc enchanted deflection. In sylph era, its better to have untypicall weapon, especially while facing 1 vs 1 gaia user.

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        • #49
          Why is this good? Take your silly crit mage/knight who only has 4k crit at L80. That's probably 30% chance to crit? Knock that down to 15%. Went from 1/3 hits being crit to 1/7. That reduces damage taken by a lot. Now, obviously you hope this procs on the slyph delphic. Taking 90k to the face really hurts. Taking 40k to the face from a delphic is pretty damn weak.
          30% lowered to 15%? Now let's say you lose when he crit, and you win when he dont crit. So, in 100 battles, you get 70 wins-30 losses. With GA, you will gain 85 wins, and 15 losses. Now that's something.

          But if we think about it in terms of dps reduction:
          30% chance to do bonus 100% dmg vs 15% chance to do bonus 100% dmg

          30% chance to do bonus 100% dmg = 1.3, his normal output
          15% chance to do bonus 100% dmg = 1.15, his output when u equip GA
          you reduced his dps by ~15%, illusion can drop enemy dps by 20%

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          • #50
            Originally posted by FufuBunnySlayer View Post
            W
            Another "bonus point" to why deflect is good is that deflect wins go to the tie. Let's say your opponent's slyph delphic (at 50%) hits you for 120k, completely kills you. But your deflect procs and hits them for 75k. They also die. You get the win. Deflect wins double KOs.

            I
            This is not true. It's either highest HP or highest BR. I know because I've been hit with a 75k deflection on my Gaia delphic, both dead. Who won? I did.

            Now whether its HP or BR that matters, dunno. I had higher in both.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by mageheal50 View Post
              30% lowered to 15%? Now let's say you lose when he crit, and you win when he dont crit. So, in 100 battles, you get 70 wins-30 losses. With GA, you will gain 85 wins, and 15 losses. Now that's something.

              But if we think about it in terms of dps reduction:
              30% chance to do bonus 100% dmg vs 15% chance to do bonus 100% dmg

              30% chance to do bonus 100% dmg = 1.3, his normal output
              15% chance to do bonus 100% dmg = 1.15, his output when u equip GA
              you reduced his dps by ~15%, illusion can drop enemy dps by 20%
              so lets assume we fight people with at least 50% crit, Ga will look a little better then. it makes more sense too cause why would u choose crit over ewd if ur critchance is only 30%?
              and then there are still many people saying that illusion triggers less often than it should... i wanna try this again some day

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              • #52
                ''Chance of receiving crit damage reduced by 5%/level''

                bit confused..

                is GA always proc the %/level if u have it on? or GA also have rate/chances to proc %/level?
                All can be killed, Dryads FTW!

                Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything.

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                • #53
                  Wow this is still going on.

                  I for one do not know the answer to any of this except what ppl mean to say what it is and actually does, but I have filed a ticket into this GA; hoping to find if its a typo or at best if we can get an answer that will really clarify its true meaning. If not, oh well.

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                  • #54
                    if u can, illusion and deflection are perfect together, lvl 80 knights might want to consider this. They hit you for 30k, you take 1 dmg and reflect back 50k ..... and your heal passive from block kicks in .... yes, i know thats a huge chance for all that to happen at once, but even if illusion and deflect proc just once in a battle, u save damage from 1 turn and wail back at them huge damage. I'm a mage and im thinking about this myself. GA is nice, but I don't think it will save ur butt in the end against a lvl 9 or 10 EWD and turns into a waste of astral space. I think block is good but Illusion and Deflection is better. Playing an archer is a gamble in the first place. Also, Illusion does have a chance to proc vs deflection. You delph for 50k dmg, lets say. His deflection procs, well ur Illusion has a chance to proc. He takes damage you don't. I'd rather take the chance of illusion and deflection personally. Block is nice but I think High Level Illusion and Deflect are worth it.
                    Death comes when you hear the Banshee.....

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                    • #55
                      Alright guys, it is now confirmed and now that I have read it, it is indeed a good astral against crit builders especially archers.

                      Here is what I recieved:




                      R2 Lorenz replied:


                      Dear Player,

                      Thank you for taking time filing this ticket regarding your concern. First of all I would like to inform you that astrals are passively activated. Meaning, you do not need it to activate as it is automatically activated both on PvP and PvE. The astral means that it takes away 5% of the opponent’s chance to land a critical hit. For example the opponent has 70% chance to land a critical hit. If you have the Guardian Angel Lvl 1 which reduces 5% critical hit chance your opponents new critcal hit chance will now turn to 65%. I hope this answers your question. If you would like to clarify it just reply to this ticket and we will explain it to at our best. Thank you and good day.

                      -The R2Games Team





                      There you have it, it is good for Class wars (archers)
                      Last edited by R24675921; 02-13-2014, 12:45 AM.

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                      • #56
                        that seems wrong tho cause a 50% critchance doesnt get reduced to 0% with a lvl 10 astral. its easy to verify this

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                        • #57
                          R2 is not the dev. They shouldnt know this stuff actually. Maybe they replied to you on how they understand the english translation of the skill description.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Setsuna88 View Post
                            that seems wrong tho cause a 50% critchance doesnt get reduced to 0% with a lvl 10 astral. its easy to verify this
                            But as no-one knows the crit formula... how do you know if someone has a 50% chance to Crit?

                            How do you know if that chance to Crit is static?
                            Originally posted by CreamySaucepan
                            You are just a freakozoid... Monster of Frankenstein meets Jabba the Hutt... Frabba the Huttstein... :P
                            Originally posted by CreamySaucepan
                            Behind every fat Space Slug is a blood thirsty sociopath urging it on.

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                            • #59
                              even with lvl 10 its pretty pointless. in cw top 10 archer fights you'll still get crit pretty often since everyone's crit rate is 90% and above...even if it reduces by 50% in absolute terms and not a multiplication you still have 40% chance to receive a crit which is pretty high.
                              IGN: Athena
                              Guild: Warriors
                              Server: S5 - Roaring Wetlands
                              Class: Archer
                              Difficulty Level: Noob
                              BR: 176k / 180k (with block and hp astral instead of illusion and deflect =P)

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Wraithraiser View Post
                                This is not true. It's either highest HP or highest BR. I know because I've been hit with a 75k deflection on my Gaia delphic, both dead. Who won? I did.

                                Now whether its HP or BR that matters, dunno. I had higher in both.
                                That's strange. Whenever I've been hit with a deflect and we both die, I lose. Not sure about the BR or HP difference, tbh, but that's an interesting theory.
                                Moreover, in an MP, whole party died, but a deflect killed the boss. We won.

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