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Best class in wartune?

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  • #76
    Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
    Hehe,in teory good idea, but practic - you need 100 start rage and only healing without dmg skills ...
    1/4 per ap is real dmglike I said, 25% of hp or around...but this is archers adventage...if similar br archer cant beat mage,if mage can beat higher br knight...for what we have other class then mage if can beat what he want?
    If mage with 50k br can heal that,what take from archer 50k br... This is to unfair, and ofc archer must have pve gear,100 start rage and ap tree on xD
    6 turns: sunt-resto-bolt-BL-bolt-resto. Rage cost: 35x2+60-10+30=150. 150-6x10-16=84. You need 84 starting rage from this, as a pve set mage I almost always start with 100 rage in BG. Heal: 65+2.5*6=83 Total hp: 40+83=123k hp (counting with the normal hp since you guys says the mage dies..)
    For archer, starting with 84 rage (let's say 75% crits): 84-15(1)-15(2)-15(3)-20(4)-15(5). Rage is now 84-80=4. Total dmg done: 15k crit*4+ 9k normal=69k dmg...
    Compared to mage healing of 83k, lacks 14k... meaning the mage can sage that last resto. Say both start with 100, I will be nice and let the archer do another crit AP (even though the rage cost needs 11 rage more at best) Total dmg done: 84k, compared to mage: 83k... result: mage have lost 1k hp and have done 2 bolts....
    If we start with no extra starting rage, even worse for the archer.. cuz after 1 AP he needs to do AS to get rage for next. (30-15/20-> 15/10 rage, AP costs 30)
    These are fair situations, no? If like Elusion said and you take 50% of the hp... yeah... then you are toast x_X (even though my resto/BL does almost 50% heal, can't deal with some1 doing that much in a single AP).

    Archers can beat mage, but TBH it's early game, atleast I take archers of my own br... archer is an early game pvp class, mage is an all time all around class ... which makes it kinda op:/.... If the archer on the other hand save rage and do a delphic at 50% on the mage, and can follow it up with an AP (100-70= AP even without crit) then he/she got a better chance of winning.. You should be dealing enough dmg on the mage for he/she to use resto on him/herself and use skills on you so he/she should have rather low rage (I take 30k+ delphic at 50%, follow that up with an AP... freaking ******* scary ._.)
    edit: since I was so tired I failed the math, that resto should not be pulled off until the next turn.
    I am to tired to redo the new cost of AP spam.. but it should be an even higher cost for the archers, so my point stands IMO.
    Last edited by krackenker; 06-24-2013, 11:59 AM.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by krackenker View Post
      I wonder what's his atk and your def then<.<?... if the archer can do almost 50% of your hp with a singel AP, then it's a strength difference and not tactics that makes you lose^^ Make a more realistic comparision.
      If I focus on healing.. in 5 turns I can heal maybe .. 75k? 2x resto+bl+ sunt for a few turns... If the archer is able to spam 5x armor piercer you should still not be dead.. With doing 20k aps.. But for a fair fight he should do maybe 10-12k(~25% of hp), something like that, which means you should do resto when off cd and an occasional BL(or suntoria if you have instead)... you should last until he is out of rage and have been using aoes/bolt on him meanwhile... so suddenly you got the advantage!
      P.S: this if he crits all APs....
      An example of why doign 50% of your hp is ridicoulos:
      The top archer in my server got maybe 6k more br then me, he do maybe 15k+ AP on me, with almost 40k hp... Now IF I had same br, I would have ~42k hp and take maybe 14k+ AP.. With only crits, but archers doesnt do 100% crits.. so...
      disclaimer:
      I AM NOT SAYING that PvE archers cant take mage, cuz they rly can, but just spamming AP should not work as easy as you say. If the archer can survive long enough to do when it's closing 50% it can frikking wipe a mage. The moment it hits 50% we're in a very bad situation and a fair high lvl fight does take that long minimum....
      Lol utter nonsense, Archer has 19k attack, I have 12k Pdef. He has 10k Mdef, I have 18k Matk.. which is average or above average.

      Archers, will take down mages easily. This is a FACT. You can Heal and AoE all you like, but at the end of the day if an archer does this, you're done.
      As you say, Healing and what not will delay the fight, getting to the 50%.. Then he'll just pop another AP and finish it?

      Comment


      • #78
        Originally posted by krackenker View Post
        6 turns: sunt-resto-bolt-BL-bolt-resto. Rage cost: 35x2+60-10+30=150. 150-6x10-16=84. You need 84 starting rage from this, as a pve set mage I almost always start with 100 rage in BG. Heal: 65+2.5*6=83 Total hp: 40+83=123k hp (counting with the normal hp since you guys says the mage dies..)
        For archer, starting with 84 rage (let's say 75% crits): 84-15(1)-15(2)-15(3)-20(4)-15(5). Rage is now 84-80=4. Total dmg done: 15k crit*4+ 9k normal=69k dmg...
        Compared to mage healing of 83k, lacks 14k... meaning the mage can sage that last resto. Say both start with 100, I will be nice and let the archer do another crit AP (even though the rage cost needs 11 rage more at best) Total dmg done: 84k, compared to mage: 83k... result: mage have lost 1k hp and have done 2 bolts....
        If we start with no extra starting rage, even worse for the archer.. cuz after 1 AP he needs to do AS to get rage for next. (30-15/20-> 15/10 rage, AP costs 30)
        These are fair situations, no? If like Elusion said and you take 50% of the hp... yeah... then you are toast x_X (even though my resto/BL does almost 50% heal, can't deal with some1 doing that much in a single AP).
        Nopewith pve set -10 rage per shot, -5 per crit each ap takes 20 rage...and you forgot you need allways 35 to use that skil...
        So 85-20=65-20=45-20=25...
        You need 100 rage for cast 4 ap in a row and 100% crit Rate = 4.5k crit...
        Making that calculations you can heal a lot more then i make dmg...
        This is what i call little unfair ... Hehe...

        _________


        Crit Mage 80v
        ~135k Br


        _________


        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
          How many ppl,that many ideas what you say is good too but all depends of situation...im not knight expert... XD i just like farm honor on knight players
          I cant keep count.. but of the knights that face me seriously in BG.. maybe 20%.. tbh I am op for my lvl and it aint easy to find many good knights, in the 60-64 bracket. I fought the strongest knight on my server to have him try this, it failed bad... but when he fought me with his normal strategy, doing high end skills (DD/EDD) at 50%, I lost maybe 50% of the fights. (it was a race, my thunderer against his delphic)

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          • #80
            Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
            Nopewith pve set -10 rage per shot, -5 per crit each ap takes 20 rage...and you forgot you need allways 35 to use that skil...
            So 85-20=65-20=45-20=25...
            You need 100 rage for cast 4 ap in a row and 100% crit Rate = 4.5k crit...
            Making that calculations you can heal a lot more then i make dmg...
            This is what i call little unfair ... Hehe...
            Try to make up a fair situation :/ it is seriously hard >_<
            Last edited by krackenker; 06-24-2013, 11:52 AM.

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by krackenker View Post
              Oh.. only 20?>_< let me redo my math, check my edited post in a few mins, might lose now>_<
              35 base rage cost, your calc take 30 base if you take -15 rage per ap

              _________


              Crit Mage 80v
              ~135k Br


              _________


              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by ElusionM View Post
                Lol utter nonsense, Archer has 19k attack, I have 12k Pdef. He has 10k Mdef, I have 18k Matk.. which is average or above average.

                Archers, will take down mages easily. This is a FACT. You can Heal and AoE all you like, but at the end of the day if an archer does this, you're done.
                As you say, Healing and what not will delay the fight, getting to the 50%.. Then he'll just pop another AP and finish it?
                I never said archers cant, I just said that AP spam should not kill mage if you just spam from round 1. If I have been unclear on that, then I apologize, however I disagree that it will be easy. Do healing delays it yes and the mage should lose when reaching 50%, but if an archer started to spam AP at you, what would you do?
                @ Anata, yh... I missunderstood>_< and yes I forgot to count that you need the rage before you can cast the skill, same with my math on the mage, long day at work so I am getting very tired:/
                EDIT: yes those stats are above average... 19k patk and 10k mdef.. quite a gap._. .... the patk is great tho.
                doing the math of the APs dmg for fun: 7k/2*1.9 (assuming he got lvl 8 determination)*1.15(the difference between dmg increased/decreased from medals should be something like that)*2(from the AP 200%)*1.1(floating dmg without floating astral)=16,825k. Without calculating if you have goddess blessing, the max dmg according to the math should be almost 17k, maximum. And I doubt he can sustain 17k crits with every ap...
                I g2g now, if you still want to we can keep on later it is fun xD
                Last edited by krackenker; 06-24-2013, 12:05 PM.

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by krackenker View Post
                  I never said archers cant, I just said that AP spam should not kill mage if you just spam from round 1. If I have been unclear on that, then I apologize.
                  @ Anata, yh... I missunderstood>_< and yes I forgot to count that you need the rage before you can cast the skill, same with my math on the mage, long day at work so I am getting very tired:/
                  Npgood talk is allways good Hehe
                  True is,mages are to powerfull.
                  If archer spend the same cash like mage...cant get that much.
                  Im to lazzy for start on new acc xD

                  _________


                  Crit Mage 80v
                  ~135k Br


                  _________


                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
                    Npgood talk is allways good Hehe
                    True is,mages are to powerfull.
                    If archer spend the same cash like mage...cant get that much.
                    Im to lazzy for start on new acc xD

                    its so wrong to argue about what class are the best.
                    because the ones that uses more Blue Crystals will be the winner ;D (asmuming they know how to build)
                    BAN-KAI

                    Joined 14/01/2013

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by Ban-kai View Post
                      its so wrong to argue about what class are the best.
                      because the ones that uses more Blue Crystals will be the winner ;D (asmuming they know how to build)
                      If we spend the same,not insane,cash - mage looks the best and this is sad True. Knight need balening like archer or more...So lets say 600k balens: mage>archer>/=knight

                      _________


                      Crit Mage 80v
                      ~135k Br


                      _________


                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
                        If we spend the same,not insane,cash - mage looks the best and this is sad True. Knight need balening like archer or more...So lets say 600k balens: mage>archer>/=knight
                        if knights spend as much as mage end game knights win..
                        BAN-KAI

                        Joined 14/01/2013

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by Ban-kai View Post
                          if knights spend as much as mage end game knights win..
                          I dont meet end game knight...or i just dont know i meet him xD
                          End game you mean 100k br and 5k+ block? I think 100k br mage can beat him

                          _________


                          Crit Mage 80v
                          ~135k Br


                          _________


                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
                            I dont meet end game knight...or i just dont know i meet him xD
                            End game you mean 100k br and 5k+ block? I think 100k br mage can beat him
                            pretty much 80k+ BR knight ;P i mean atm i hit mages with delphic for 35-45k or more .. at 50% i dont see how mages gonna survive that .. on 100k+ Br even ;D
                            BAN-KAI

                            Joined 14/01/2013

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Ban-kai View Post
                              pretty much 80k+ BR knight ;P i mean atm i hit mages with delphic for 35-45k or more .. at 50% i dont see how mages gonna survive that .. on 100k+ Br even ;D
                              Good for ubut make that hard knight is not simple for 98% ppl xD

                              _________


                              Crit Mage 80v
                              ~135k Br


                              _________


                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by AnataOFAkku View Post
                                Good for ubut make that hard knight is not simple for 98% ppl xD
                                o well not to hard either i have 5-6 month game play with only 4800 vip points.. so its not to hard.. and expensive..
                                BAN-KAI

                                Joined 14/01/2013

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