I got an ideea about this inconvenience for def rune

[THORR_S3]

what about to hide the icon skill to no1 can know with what skill will hit and when? (make icon skills be invisible for oponents)
i think this is a 1 good solution its better than nothing!
in this way mage will never know when we will use the delphic skill of sylph !

[MrFancyPants]

I didn't forget. That's the point. Everyone complains about heals, but given the chance to wield them, they opt out. Don't you realize that mages have the same problem Tritons do? The more heals we bring, the less room we have for attacks...you know, those silly things that win fights. Relying entirely on sylph for wins is foolish. Its an important part of strategy, but there are many things that can block skills and nerf attacks.

Mage heals and triton heals are not comparable, for the simple reason that sylph damage is so often massively higher than hero damage. So your hero attacks are far less relevant to winning, and triton's lower damage will cost you a lot. I'm not sure what BGs you're in, but in every close fight I have, sylph attacks are THE deciding factor, essentially every time. For fights that aren't close, then one player can kill the other without needing to sylph, and heals only matter for starting hp in the next fight.

Also, bringing a triton means you're going to spend a lot longer in an average fight, especially if you win, so even if you might win a little more often, it wouldn't necessarily be the smart move to bring one.

[pietjeprecies]

Wow, now people suggest to take a triton to bg...

Guess most smart players have quit, only the dumbest stay arround...
Wait whut that includes me then

[R225424182]

what about to hide the icon skill to no1 can know with what skill will hit and when? (make icon skills be invisible for oponents)
i think this is a 1 good solution its better than nothing!
in this way mage will never know when we will use the delphic skill of sylph !

lag and slow connection speeds already do that. Many find themselves reacting to moves made 2 turns ago by their opponents because of it.

[FufuBunnySlayer]

I didn't forget. That's the point. Everyone complains about heals, but given the chance to wield them, they opt out. Don't you realize that mages have the same problem Tritons do? The more heals we bring, the less room we have for attacks...you know, those silly things that win fights. Relying entirely on sylph for wins is foolish. Its an important part of strategy, but there are many things that can block skills and nerf attacks.

I understand the point you're trying to make, but it doesn't really work because the comparison is not comparable.

Slyph damage is so far above player the comparison of an archer/knight/mage to herc or cerb is absurd. Heals are heals. Triton can heal a little more than mage, but as said above it's a stalling tactic, just as mage heals are. Stalling to get to slyph mode in the best (most HP) position. Using triton as a pure stall build doesn't work so well anymore since bleed is weaker now than it used to be.

[Nolikeki]

In any game where players can play different classes with different abilities, people will continue to complain about game balance.

Most mages / archer use guard rune + heal rune in pvp. Knights use amnesia + heal rune. As I see, amensia can achieve as much damage reduction - if not more - as guard rune. It's more random, yes, but you don't rely on internet speed / lag like guard rune.

If the skills weren't visible, it would further increase the random factor of the game, of which we have enough already, thx

[ArnaudBo]

Every class has their own way to heal and access to a heal rune. In theory, every class has the ability to go into sylph mode full healed.

yes, but mage are the only who can wait before entering sylph and even sylph later, when they have full healed

[KS222]

if you could win a fight before sylph, the sylph you have don't matter anyway. so damage skill before sylph are only worth against people you can easily kill or, for mage, to reduce the HP of opponent who can't heal himself easily
in sylph, damage matter. for close fight, being full heal just before sylph is a big advantage.

I pick the sylph to use based on what skill set I want to bring to the fight. In 1 vs 1, I generally go for dps because I am trying to win the fight solo rather than support a team. When supporting a team, I favor Gaia because it lets me tank hits better and gives me higher resistance to one of the most popular elements. Gaia lacks the dps of Herc and Cerberus, but it has aoes and debuffs; both are quite useful when fighting a group. In ToK nm, Medusa is often a big help. Its steal skill shortens the AI's sylph round and its an off element, allowing me to hit harder. The resistance debuff is also useful for allowing my whole team to nuke the AIs that much better. Since my Medusa is still fairly weak, I have to switch to Gaia for the later floors; I lose the element advantage, but tank hits better and can nerf the AI mage heals with Devil's Gaze.

Every class has their own way to heal and access to a heal rune. In theory, every class has the ability to go into sylph mode full healed.

[ArnaudBo]

I didn't forget. That's the point. Everyone complains about heals, but given the chance to wield them, they opt out. Don't you realize that mages have the same problem Tritons do? The more heals we bring, the less room we have for attacks...you know, those silly things that win fights. Relying entirely on sylph for wins is foolish. Its an important part of strategy, but there are many things that can block skills and nerf attacks.

if you could win a fight before sylph, the sylph you have don't matter anyway. so damage skill before sylph are only worth against people you can easily kill or, for mage, to reduce the HP of opponent who can't heal himself easily
in sylph, damage matter. for close fight, being full heal just before sylph is a big advantage.

[Xeptone]

KS222 .... nice point but u nid to drive it home to silence ppl

[KS222]

so that is the nail that drive it to the wall

ks222 bait u to say using triton to heal is just foolish and trolling but does not give u a win

you forget slyph is there to deal damage healing in sylph will just make the fight longer . it's seldom a winning choice ( UR OWN WORDS )

YOU FORGET MAGE NID TO DEAL DAMAGE TO KILL IN SOLO FIGHT HEALING WILL JUST MAKE THE FIGHT LONGER ITS SELDOM A WINNING CHOICE ( MY DEFENSE COPYING UR WORD CHANGE CONTEXT BUT REMAIN TRUE TO ITS MEANING )

NUFF SAID

That actually is the point. If heals were as OP as everyone claims, Triton would be the most popular sylph.

[Xeptone]

so that is the nail that drive it to the wall

ks222 bait u to say using triton to heal is just foolish and trolling but does not give u a win

you forget slyph is there to deal damage healing in sylph will just make the fight longer . it's seldom a winning choice ( UR OWN WORDS )

YOU FORGET MAGE NID TO DEAL DAMAGE TO KILL IN SOLO FIGHT HEALING WILL JUST MAKE THE FIGHT LONGER ITS SELDOM A WINNING CHOICE ( MY DEFENSE COPYING UR WORD CHANGE CONTEXT BUT REMAIN TRUE TO ITS MEANING )

NUFF SAID

[KS222]

you forget sylph is there to deal damage. healing in sylph will just make the fight longer. it's seldom a winning choice
for my triton, i have the 2 heal and the shield. not really useful in solo fight

chaos is random. even under chaos there is 50% (?) he will heal himself anyway

I didn't forget. That's the point. Everyone complains about heals, but given the chance to wield them, they opt out. Don't you realize that mages have the same problem Tritons do? The more heals we bring, the less room we have for attacks...you know, those silly things that win fights. Relying entirely on sylph for wins is foolish. Its an important part of strategy, but there are many things that can block skills and nerf attacks.

[ArnaudBo]

you forget sylph is there to deal damage. healing in sylph will just make the fight longer. it's seldom a winning choice
for my triton, i have the 2 heal and the shield. not really useful in solo fight

chaos is random. even under chaos there is 50% (?) he will heal himself anyway

[KS222]

I disagree about mage heal + guardian being OP. If that was the case, then the most OP possible combination would be Archer with Triton and guardian rune. That gives you high natural dps, attack buff passive, instant mega defense troll, and OP crit heals.

Guardian rune lasts only 2 turns. When timed right, it can troll your delphic. Are so many players so reliant on their sylph delphic that they can't win fights any other way? I look at it this way. When they pop guardian, they can't use any other rune for 30 sec. I can take my time with no fear of amnesia, chaos, heal, or bleed being used against me. Sylphs have more than just one hard hit; delph gets trolled, hold your other hard hits til the rune is gone. Or, use the other hard hits early to try to bait them into using the rune, wait it out, then nuke with delph. A 2 turn super def troll is hardly an insurmountable obstacle.

Every class has some form of heal available and only mage heals can be stolen by chaos. Mages have more heals, but all except heal rune can be stolen, seems somewhat balanced. Bring chaos to troll mages if you hate the heal spam. If you don't want to bring chaos, how about bringing a skill to nerf heals? Knights have advanced class skill to do it. Hades/Gaia have Devil's Gaze, also a heal nerf. Added bonus: Devil's Gaze is also a hard hit. Save it til near end of sylph round and it'll cut their heal in half unless they are able to wait a couple turns before healing. If you don't want to do that, how about bringing your own heal spam? Equip triton and heal spam right back at them. Since few defend against water, you'll also hit most players harder due to their lack of resistance.

Considering how many complain about heal spam being OP, I'd expect to see a bg/fire temple full of Tritons. Seriously guys. If heal spam is so great, why do you not use Triton?