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Class War Robbery!

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  • Pyranthos
    started a topic Class War Robbery!

    Class War Robbery!

    By now, most people know you need 3500 pts to make it into finals. Well, for the 13th CW in a row, I received 3375 pts total, only THIS TIME I was infuriated to no end. Why, you may wonder? Because i had a lengthy fight with a fellow mage. After sylph mode wore off, we had both killed eachothers side sylphs and midgets, I had over 95% life and my opponent had less than 20% life, but it timed out, and on my screen i received the "FAILURE" notification.. It was obvious at this point I had won that fight, and now, as a result of that bogus garbage, i once again get denied finals, and the chance that I genuinely deserve to purchase some of the better glory shop items. There is no question about it, I was the winner of that fight, and didn't get credit. This is a very serious flaw with CW, and unfair to no end. The other 12 cw's, i just didn't win enough, straight up, this time I did, but because of that ONE fight, I get denied again? Everything I want to say about that will get filtered, so I'll simply say "Good job r2! We always expect the best from you and once again, you didn't disappoint" (laden with as much sarcasm as I can muster)

    I wish I wasn't so enraged or caught off guard to note said mage's name. I hope whoever it was posts here and verifies my claim. I am NOT making it up. Not like the dev's would do anything about it anyways, but I'm ticked off and had to vocalize it.
    Last edited by Pyranthos; 04-29-2015, 03:21 AM.

  • Pyranthos
    replied
    Originally posted by Fherlayt View Post
    For a long time, in case of both players surviving at end in CW, the player with the more life won. This was a very, very bad system, it was a heal-war for mages, didnt matter what you do, you just had to use a big heal 3 seconds before it was over. Fortunately, this is no longer the case, now damage counts. This system is much more fair, but it is also much more difficult to check for the players to see if the calculation was correct. In other games, there is a combat log, but here it's not the case. So the only thing you can do is record the whole CW with some video recording program, and after the CW, check the whole fight, note down the damages. Bugs are always a possibility.

    Some notes:
    - Eudaemon damage does not count in World boss, Atoll boss and Guild boss. So it is very likely that it doesn't count in Class Wars either.
    - If you are a stronger player, and your aoe kills your opponnents sylph / eudaemon outright, while your opponents continues to nuke your minions for several rounds while you keep healing them, he might end up dealing more damage than you.
    - In general, dont bother much about healing in CW, unless your opponent would kill you otherwise. But this is usually not the case, as I remember, the last 2 CW finals there was like 1-1 fights where I got killed (although used only suntoria and Hades heal), in other fights the decision factor was who dealt more damage.
    I see what you mean about the heal war at the buzzer for fights that are determined by how much health the player has, but still feel it should be that way. Mages can cast heal. Heal can crit, which can shift who has more hpts at the end. BUT... Mages are generally frail, and br differences matter A LOT when it comes to kill or be killed.. Someone with 200k more br than me doesn't have to worry about the heal thing. I'd be dead long before that.

    And IF it comes to a heal race, there are ways to win at that too. Hades skill can severely cripple their healing abilities, or even a nice lil chaos rune, but regardless, at least that way, its a skill based win (meaning I cast the skill restoration, and thus had more hpts at the end) and gives a clear cut winner, not this bogus "you lost bc he did 500k dmg to your weakest sylph when it only had 20k hpts.. that 480k pts of extra damage means jack squat.. Overkill dmg should never determine a winner, and as annoying as a last second heal fight would be, at least the players could KNOW the outcome, not feel reamed by a cheap system with background calculations that you feel VERY STRONGLY were inaccurate.

    And in no way should a player be penalized for being able to keep his crew alive better. A heal on a sylph thats already been thumped on should NEGATE the dmg factored in to the attackers score. It should in no way allow them to gain even more of an edge. Changing the entire system just to solve that situation is a poor approach. There were far better ways, like the one I just suggested, to counteract that situation. They just chose the cheesy, lame and lazy route. The way its set up, you are better off leaving your weakest sylphs out, and only bringing one uber strong aoe oriented sylph. Thats pathetic. You are now penalized for bringing everything you can muster, as you would in an actual war, in an effort to win. IDK if I'm explaining this clearly or not, but the main point is, any system that encourages you to handicap yourself just to improve your odds, is a busted system.

    At least a last minute heal at the buzzer fight is mages using their skills and being able to see the actual result, vs that bogus garbage surprise failure notification like I experienced.

    It doesn't matter anymore though. BC of this and a MULTITUDE of other things wrong with this game, I'm on my way out anyways. I've had enough of this stupid game, its rigged scenarios and randomized boxes, its tiresome money money money gimmicks non stop, its horrible customer service, its neglected bugs and lag that they seem to think we have to live with, etc.. This game is not the game I grew so fond of anymore. Its in shambles, and the powers that be couldn't care less, and that is not a game I feel a lingering desire to stick with.

    Can't even get through a simple little DW run without needing at least one refresh. The lag has gotten soo horribly outta control, and patch after patch after patch, maint after maint after maint, the lag only gets worse, never fixed. I can't support a game, financially or otherwise, that can't be valued enough by its owners to bother with fixing it, and caring what its players have to say about it.

    If they don't take pride in what they do, and care for the best interest of that which is making them rich, the game and its players, then they can take this game, and shove it so far up where the sun don't shine that they have to yawn to see the log in screen.
    Last edited by Pyranthos; 05-07-2015, 01:35 PM.

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  • Fherlayt
    replied
    For a long time, in case of both players surviving at end in CW, the player with the more life won. This was a very, very bad system, it was a heal-war for mages, didnt matter what you do, you just had to use a big heal 3 seconds before it was over. Fortunately, this is no longer the case, now damage counts. This system is much more fair, but it is also much more difficult to check for the players to see if the calculation was correct. In other games, there is a combat log, but here it's not the case. So the only thing you can do is record the whole CW with some video recording program, and after the CW, check the whole fight, note down the damages. Bugs are always a possibility.

    Some notes:
    - Eudaemon damage does not count in World boss, Atoll boss and Guild boss. So it is very likely that it doesn't count in Class Wars either.
    - If you are a stronger player, and your aoe kills your opponnents sylph / eudaemon outright, while your opponents continues to nuke your minions for several rounds while you keep healing them, he might end up dealing more damage than you.
    - In general, dont bother much about healing in CW, unless your opponent would kill you otherwise. But this is usually not the case, as I remember, the last 2 CW finals there was like 1-1 fights where I got killed (although used only suntoria and Hades heal), in other fights the decision factor was who dealt more damage.

    Leave a comment:


  • KS222
    replied
    Eudaemon might actually be a handicap as they are one more thing to take those overkill hits. Unless you cash the current events to max, chances are your eudaemon will have low resist and will get nuked by sylphs a lot easier. It does suck for lower levels; you're now essentially 1 vs 2 and that damage technicality matters only if you live til the buzzer.

    I think many players have been cheated by fights where it looked like they were winning, all the numbers seemed to be in their favor, and then the buzzer declares it a loss. Unlike HP, we have no constant gauge showing us damage done. We remember that in general, we got bigger numbers than they did, then get a shock when it says we lost. It would be nice if the devs would add a gage letting us see total damage done. That would let us see what counts and what doesn't and would also help us avoid these "cheap" losses, where we were winning right up until the game says we lost.

    Leave a comment:


  • GM_Magik
    replied
    Originally posted by Castway136 View Post
    also im 90% sure damage not recieved but dealt to iceshield and argoran shield counts
    Sadly, I don't think we really have any way to confirm or deny that one. However.. it is clear this round of class wars was more difficult then others due to the inclusion of the Eudaemons. I understand how you feel.. robbed, angry and perhaps even outright cheated. I do know many find it especially unfair that the Eudaemons were included as you have to be level 70 to utilize these and class wars is open to those below that level.. and I am sorry. At this time it is an unknown if the next seasons class wars will be altered or not.

    Leave a comment:


  • Castway136
    replied
    also im 90% sure damage not recieved but dealt to iceshield and argoran shield counts

    Leave a comment:


  • LyNxEfecT
    replied
    But your triton rain dance healed your whole team and his Gaia has 2 skills at aoe damage to rack up the damage dealt. The fact he not have ice shield then let's his troops die first meaning you can't do damage to them but he can still damage all of yours as yours healed once or twice... So his damage will be far superior

    Leave a comment:


  • kevs926
    replied
    it's simple you're not strong enough.

    if you are really strong enough, you can get in even with bad luck

    Leave a comment:


  • Pyranthos
    replied
    Originally posted by Mentor_MrEUS View Post
    Pyranthos,I'm sorry you're frustrated, but without seeing the battle as it happened, it's a bit hard to say who won for sure.

    I found that back in April of 2014, the Class Wars were modified around the way a "timed out" battle is decided.


    A quote from that post:

    "Within a round, if neither player is defeated within 3 minutes the victory will go to the player who deals the most damage. If damage dealt is the same then the victory goes to the contestant with the higher battle rating."



    Did you heal yourself or your team of sylphs and Eudaemon during the battle? If you did, your opponent would have been able to deal more damage to you and your team that would have added to the damage they did prior to your heal.

    So in the end, while you had more HP, that doesn't mean more damage wasn't dealt to you. Since everyone heals themselves during the battle, especially when using Tritons and mage class Eudaemons.
    Well, my side sylphs were Gaia (1 star purp) and Triton (also 1 star purp), both around 40k br, so nothing very impressive. I was using Herc as main, his was gaia. He had Herc and Triton as side sylphs, and they seemed to be on par with mine. (same sylphs line up, just diff ones set as mains). Same situation for the midgets, we both had archers that seemed to be rather even. My spell line up consisted of LB, RoF, Suntoria, Restoration, and IceBolt. I didn't even use Restoration, and both our tritons cast rain dance once. Thats the only heal my triton even has, and he didn't seem to have ice shield, so none of the damage I dealt was blocked. I'm fairly certain I did more damage during the fight.

    I'm beyond frustrated. It's hard as nails for a light casher like myself to make finals, and if time permitted, I would of been the only one left alive at the end. THAT is how a winner should be determined. I've busted my butt trying to make it to finals for over a year now, and I genuinely feel that this was my time. I earned it, and didn't get it, all because of some stupid irrelevant factors. Total damage dealt should not matter one iota. What should matter is who is closer to killing the other, period. And that was ME. We were fairly evenly matched, cept it seemed I had better def and crit than he did, hence him being lower on life at the end. I'm soo sick of getting 3375 pts EVERY CW. Twice in a row is coincidence, 13x in a row is a flawed matching system. And when you are clearly the one who would of won given even a mere 10 seconds more, you earned the dam win and deserve it.

    I'm livid about missing finals again bc of some stupid, nonsensical technicality. Excess damage to a sylph as it dies has no impact on who lives, so it should have no impact on who wins, period. The winner should be the one in better shape at the buzzer, in this case, me, by about 75% more life.

    Edit: I had typed ice armor, i meant ice shield. Get those 2 mixed up all the time.
    Last edited by Pyranthos; 04-29-2015, 07:00 PM.

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  • yaafa
    replied
    Originally posted by minimeeee View Post
    it even says in the description of help tab(while in prelims waiting to go in fight, cant get a SS now since its over) in CW fights that if timer runs out, the one with higher hp is declared winner. if same % of hp left then its determined by br. if similar br it is then random.
    I'm sorry but this doesn't work anymore. It used to be the case a while ago but it got changed. It's not based on how much hp you have at the end

    Leave a comment:


  • Arlad
    replied
    Originally posted by Mentor_MrEUS View Post
    Pyranthos,I'm sorry you're frustrated, but without seeing the battle as it happened, it's a bit hard to say who won for sure.

    I found that back in April of 2014, the Class Wars were modified around the way a "timed out" battle is decided.

    ah, finally. i was trying to find that post for months, many people didnt believe when i said its based on highest damage dealt.


    A quote from that post:

    "Within a round, if neither player is defeated within 3 minutes the victory will go to the player who deals the most damage. If damage dealt is the same then the victory goes to the contestant with the higher battle rating."



    Did you heal yourself or your team of sylphs and Eudaemon during the battle? If you did, your opponent would have been able to deal more damage to you and your team that would have added to the damage they did prior to your heal.

    So in the end, while you had more HP, that doesn't mean more damage wasn't dealt to you. Since everyone heals themselves during the battle, especially when using Tritons and mage class Eudaemons.
    ah, finally. i was trying to found that post for a long time. many people didnt believe when i said tiebreaker is based on highest damage dealt.

    ps: only 2 posts and you seems more promising than other mentors, please dont fail our expectations.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mentor_MrEUS
    replied
    Pyranthos,I'm sorry you're frustrated, but without seeing the battle as it happened, it's a bit hard to say who won for sure.

    I found that back in April of 2014, the Class Wars were modified around the way a "timed out" battle is decided.


    A quote from that post:

    "Within a round, if neither player is defeated within 3 minutes the victory will go to the player who deals the most damage. If damage dealt is the same then the victory goes to the contestant with the higher battle rating."



    Did you heal yourself or your team of sylphs and Eudaemon during the battle? If you did, your opponent would have been able to deal more damage to you and your team that would have added to the damage they did prior to your heal.

    So in the end, while you had more HP, that doesn't mean more damage wasn't dealt to you. Since everyone heals themselves during the battle, especially when using Tritons and mage class Eudaemons.
    Last edited by Mentor_MrEUS; 04-29-2015, 09:30 AM. Reason: formatting fix

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  • Nubito
    replied
    i think i'am lucky, get 3100 any qualified to final
    but funny thing hapen in battle, in my side my char and 1 sylph survive
    in enemy side, only 1 sylph left with less than half hp left
    when time out, i lost. lol

    Leave a comment:


  • minimeeee
    replied
    it even says in the description of help tab(while in prelims waiting to go in fight, cant get a SS now since its over) in CW fights that if timer runs out, the one with higher hp is declared winner. if same % of hp left then its determined by br. if similar br it is then random.

    Leave a comment:


  • gruntar
    replied
    Well...the thing i can think of is, if you had more hp, a lot more, then your sylphs will have a lot more hp than his too, and as a result, when they are killed off, they do give a lot more to his damage count, while you get less for killing his...thus netting a few hundred k damage difference just from that...same with eudaemon

    Leave a comment:

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