Short End of the Stick?

[Zorich]

Lol that's so cheap!

Nah, what's cheap is when I used to not qualify (before the east-coast split) and would go 14-1 in prelims, rank 2nd overall, and because my BR was ranked 50+ I'd get relegated to the 2nd tier. So I'm playing the system now .

Honestly though, if I don't merge my Sylph soon, I won't qualify in another CW or two. I'm giving up millions of BR to the top-5 Mages in my X-Server group.

[R238423534]

I just dislike the designer makes hero skills sound like eudaemon skills (even the pictures look alike). eudies are helpful as a sidekick, but most of their skills are really not-so-impressive. & it's arguable if archer really makes more rage using an AOE if the crit +5 rage passive is gone. not looking forward to it until i see solid proof of the new skills being better in general (not for specific scenario).

[Zorich]

I just dislike the designer makes hero skills sound like eudaemon skills (even the pictures look alike). eudies are helpful as a sidekick, but most of their skills are really not-so-impressive. & it's arguable if archer really makes more rage using an AOE if the crit +5 rage passive is gone. not looking forward to it until i see solid proof of the new skills being better in general (not for specific scenario).

Archers have a passive to gain Rage Back. And Take Rage. And Gain Awakening. And give Party Damage Buffs. And Self-Heal. And Damage Debuff like the Wind Ranger. And Drop Stackable Bleeds like the Wind Ranger.

The Marksman Passvies... All About Gaining Rage & Awakening and Doing Damage.
- Evil Revelation: (L5) 35% Chance to gain +5 Rage per Critical
- Support Expert: (L1) 20% Chance to gain 50 Awakening per Critical (Awakening Pts should Increment w/ Higher Levels)
- Crack Shot: (L1) 20% Chance to increase party Damage Dealt by 15% (35% @L5?), 3x Stackable.
- Hunting Leader: (L1) 20% Chance to Increase Enemy Damage Received by 20%. (Damage Increase % should Increment)

As to the Survival Passives... About Stealing Rage, Self Healing and Bleeding the Enemy.
- Heart Piercer: (L1) 20% Chance to decrease enemy's Rage by 10 when dealing damage (30 @L5?)
- Phantom Echo: (L1) 20% Chance to Heal 15% of Damage Dealt (35% Heal @L5?)
- Death Mark: (L1) 20% Chance to cause 50% PAtk Bleed (90% @L5?), 3x Stackable
- Decisive Moment: (L5) 35% Chance to restore 1% Max HP each time damage is dealt.

[Zorich]

Knight Passives...

Fury Path:
- Blood Surge: (L1) 20% Chance to gain 10 Rage when Attacking (50 Rage @L5?)
- Leader Mien: (L1) 20% Chance to gain 200 Awaken Points when Attacking (550 Awakening @L5?)
- Valorous: (L1) 20% Chance to Increase Damage Dealt by 50% when Attacking (90% @L5? More?)
- Cold Killer: (L1) 20% Chance to decrease Target's Received Healing by 30% when Attacking. 2 Turns. (50% @L5)

As if Knight's didn't get enough Rage already... 20% Chance to just keep getting it for free. And free Awakening. And a massive personal damage boost, that when potentially triggered on "Deicide" makes that skill go well over 1000% Damage. The Healing Debuff is meh. No one's gonna heal anymore except on triggered effects.

Defense Path:
- Dauntless: (L5) 35% Chance to restore 1% Max HP after Blocking.
- Victory Pledge: (L1) 20% Chance to gain 100 Awakening after Blocking. (200 Awakening @L5?)
- Reverse Storm: (L1) 20% Chance to reflect 25% Damage after Blocking. (45% @L5? 65%?)
- Wrath Crack: (L1) 20% Chance to Reduce Damage by 35% after Blocking. 2 Turns. (55% @L5)

Ok, so Wrath Crack is a free Guardian Shield. If you're being attacked 4+ times each turn (from things like group battles, sylph troops, etc..), this will pretty much stay on consistently because of it's 2-round duration. In a Titan War setup, it's like almost having a perma-guardian. Combine it with the Knight's active skill of "Blade Barrier" - which is said to be a 65% DR Shield - and you've got an insanely strong defensive bulwark. Can we agree this puts the "Guardian is Broken" argument to rest once and for all now?

Victory Pledge is gonna be crazy in a TW type setup too. With all the kid AoEs and player AoEs going off, the Defense Knight could find himself ready to awaken 2nd Turn.

[Zorich]

Lastly (literally) the Mage...

Arcane Path Passives:
- Energy Control (L5) 20% Chance to Decrease Enemy Awakening Points by 550 when dealing Damage.
- Divine Shield: (L5) 20% Chance to Reduce Damage Received by 35% (2 Turns) when Dealing Damage.
- Death Curse: (L5) 20% Chance to Decrease Enemy Resist by 35% (2 Turns) when Dealing Damage. 3x Stackable!
- Mana Miracle (L5) 35% Chance to Remove an Enemy Buff when Dealing Damage.

Not gonna lie - these are pretty good. Almost makes up for how crappy the Default Skills are. Almost... Not quite. The nice thing is that these effect trigger "when dealing damage" so multi-tap skills have multi-tap chances of firing off the effect. Fiery Lotus hits 2x per Target, and Hell's Requiem hits 3x per Target. Firing those off in succession FL, HR, FL (If one has the Rage), should have 7 potential triggers, meaning it should clear (consistantly) 2 buffs per target in that time as well as drop resist, enact a DR shield and drop enemy awakening. Nice combo of self-preservation and enemy suppression.

Restoration Path Passives:
- Mana Reflux: (L5) 35% Chance to Heal the Entire Party 1% of Max HP after each action.
- Soul Transformation: (L5) 35% Chance to Heal Party Member (Lowest HP) by 5% Max HP after each action.
- Seed of Wisdom: (L5) 20% Chance to Increase all Resistances by 35% (2 Turns) after each action. 3x Stackable!
- War Blessing: (L5) 35% Chance to Remove a Negative Buff from each Party Member after each action.

And in typical form... These are just AWFUL. Because they're after "each action", the Resistance Buffer will really never stack, although a 35% buff is potentially nice even if short-lived. Mana Reflux and Soul Transformation are just awful. Even if they triggered every turn, it'd be less effective than a non-KH Sunto or L4 Kid Sunto. Meh.

War Blessing is the only worthwhile one - but given the immense nerf to healing, the poor passives and the weakest set of Basic Skills. This just further proves that the Mage -> Restoration Path is a step down from a non-Knighthood Mage overall. No reason to take it at all. Period.

[SlowPlay]

Can we agree this puts the "Guardian is Broken" argument to rest once and for all now?

Nop, this does

- Dauntless: (L5) 35% Chance to restore 1% Max HP after Blocking.

if it has no cap. Also guardian is 70%, 35% is half of that And tbh

- Seed of Wisdom: (L5) 20% Chance to Increase all Resistances by 35% (2 Turns) after each action. 3x Stackable!

i see this being broken in the future.

Overall i don't like any of those passive, chance to procs is lame (illu docet).

[Arlad]

this reminds me to a game i played years ago. when the 3rd Jobs were introduced, the game quickly went downhill because all of them too OP. and this game is worse with the ridiculous requirement for the knighthood.
some people might think that if everyone is OP, then the game is balanced. but in this game knighthood is clearly not for everyone.

[Zorich]

Nop, this does

if it has no cap. Also guardian is 70%, 35% is half of that And tbh

i see this being broken in the future.

Overall i don't like any of those passive, chance to procs is lame (illu docet).

I kinda didn't follow what you were trying to say, but let me see if I can piece it together...

What I got is this... Yes, the 1% Max HP Gain on Block will be uncapped. I think overdue coming back, and at 1%, it's not a game-breaker. Plus it's on the "Defend" branch, so to get it one would effectively "sacrifice" their only AoE and the 750% Delphic.

Yes, Guardian is 70% for 2 Turns, Wrath Crack is supposedly 55% (L5) and has a 20% chance to trigger on any block, renewing itself. The 35% is L1. Some have speculated it's actually going to be 75% at L5 - which would just be f'ed in the head to have a 75% DR just keep popping up as a passive for free... At that point, I don't think a knight would even consider taking the "Fury" Path.

Seed of Wisdom, if you're implying it's potentially OP, rest assured it's not. No 20% Trigger is ever going to stack on an "Action" attempt with any regularity. 1 in 5 of triggering, 1 in 5 of stacking after trigger. 1 in 25, or, 4% chance overall to get a x2 stack. A x3 Stack is < a 1% occurrence. The key to any 20% Power being really good that requires stacks to get crazy, is initiating on a multiple-occurrence action. Block, Critical, Deal Damage. Tied to that, they're great. Tied to an "Action" - not so great.

Seriously, if I see any Mage take the Restoration path, I'd have to assume they're a plant or just REALLY wanted to play a Basic D&D Priest in Wartune. It's that bad. Like, it's so bad a non-KH Mage will do better damage in PvE AND heal better / remove debuffs better in PvP .

[Arlad]

someone need to be reminded that guardian rune is :
- an active skill
- has long cooldown
- relatively takes a long time to max level.
- only last 2 rounds.
- need an allocated slot that can be used for other useful runes.

[Alsatia01]

Seed of Wisdom, if you're implying it's potentially OP, rest assured it's not. No 20% Trigger is ever going to stack on an "Action" attempt with any regularity. 1 in 5 of triggering, 1 in 5 of stacking after trigger. 1 in 25, or, 4% chance overall to get a x2 stack. A x3 Stack is < a 1% occurrence. The key to any 20% Power being really good that requires stacks to get crazy, is initiating on a multiple-occurrence action. Block, Critical, Deal Damage. Tied to that, they're great. Tied to an "Action" - not so great.

Well I have a question, are we talking about math and probability, or are we talking about r2 math and probability?

Two words - Illusion Astral.

[SlowPlay]

Plus it's on the "Defend" branch, so to get it one would effectively "sacrifice" their only AoE and the 750% Delphic.

Wait a second. If a player has enough tatoo to have both path unlocked, don't those passive always work? Even while using the other tree? Noone on my server has unlocked knighthood and too lazy to google so i just have to rely on what you write there and a bit of common sense.

- need an allocated slot that can be used for other useful runes.

Yet most archer and mage use it which make me think that maybe guardian is the most usefull of all the rune.

[Zorich]

Wait a second. If a player has enough tatoo to have both path unlocked, don't those passive always work? Even while using the other tree? Noone on my server has unlocked knighthood and too lazy to google so i just have to rely on what you write there and a bit of common sense.

No - those passives have to have skill points allocated to them to work, and they require skills be L3 (I believe) on their respective path to open up. So really you get 2 or 3 at max probably.

[SlowPlay]

No - those passives have to have skill points allocated to them to work, and they require skills be L3 (I believe) on their respective path to open up. So really you get 2 or 3 at max probably.

Well then without knowing how many skill point we'll have etc it's kinda hard to tell what is good tbh.

[R2138739441]

Well then without knowing how many skill point we'll have etc it's kinda hard to tell what is good tbh.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say the total number of skill points for Knighthood will be 32. I'm currently a lvl 7 Trainee Swordsman and when I got knighthed, I automatically had 1 point each in the basic 2 skills and 10 free points to spend. I got 1 point at level 2 and the next one at level 6. So assuming 1 skill point every 4 levels, like the first class advancement, that's 20 more points once you've gained all 80 levels of knighthood. So 32 points to put into 45 slots of each skill set.

[SlowPlay]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say the total number of skill points for Knighthood will be 32. I'm currently a lvl 7 Trainee Swordsman and when I got knighthed, I automatically had 1 point each in the basic 2 skills and 10 free points to spend. I got 1 point at level 2 and the next one at level 6. So assuming 1 skill point every 4 levels, like the first class advancement, that's 20 more points once you've gained all 80 levels of knighthood. So 32 points to put into 45 slots of each skill set.

What class do you play?