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Knights block or archers crit

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  • supermogey
    started a topic Knights block or archers crit

    Knights block or archers crit

    Personally I feel Archers crit rate needs to be reduced, or Knights block needs to be increased.
    Sorry for leaving you mages out, but you do mdmg and both archers and kngihts have crappy mdef anyway,and you have HEAL!!! so your cool =P
    but for knights and archers there is a clear disadvantage that should not be there.

    Balanacing = knight beats archer
    Mage beats knight
    Archer beats mage

    That is the way it is susposed to work, knights are supposed to have crazy defense and hp way above the other classes.
    Archer is susposed to have crazy pdmg over the other classes
    and mage , well they have mdmg which the other classes are not susposed to be able to defend well against, and they can HEAL!!!!

    Im not saying there arent alot of good knights out there, but I am saying that those knights will have at some point been forced to use cash shop just to compete against the other classes who have not had to use cash shop.

    By any standard, Knights should have as high a block rate as archers have crit rate (you know, defense vrs dmg, like it should be?) or archers have as low crit rate as knights have block.
    Now i do remember archers complaining a while back about their crit rate dropping, but according to everyone, that was fixed and they crit 99% of the time again, so why not get off your ***** and fix knights block rate? =P (no offense intented, lol)
    Last edited by supermogey; 03-31-2013, 08:57 AM.

  • dwmedia
    replied
    Originally posted by JeffAdams View Post
    I would suggest you ask archers about there crit rate before you say it needs to be reduced. In WB the crit rate has gone up for everyone. I understand that some people may have to redo their toon to take advantage of that and it helps archers more than anyone, but the crit rate for archers has dropped since the last patch in everything other than WB. I dont know about the knights block rate but saying archers crit 99% of the time is a very inacurate comment
    Crit in World boss is reduced alot for archer if them have low crit, i have 2 archer one me 700 crit a low lvl archer them crit not so mutch them crit maby 1 of 5 attacks att world boss.

    And my 65 archer crit maby 3-4 of 5 attacks.

    Everything depends how hige crit them have higre crit give higre chance.

    Higre hp or defens a monster or player have you higre need the critical stats be for that get a critical.

    If a archer have very low critical them never crit and never get rage.

    Leave a comment:


  • Erasmus123
    replied
    yes love your suggestion..im a knight and have 1k block and my enemy is an archer has 1k crit..i block his attack 1 time in a duel he hitted me with his arrow strike its always crit!


    they should balance it"

    Leave a comment:


  • KnowingEyes7
    replied
    Actually, the devs must have felt the knight was too squishy since in 1.6 they get 3x heal @ 35% of total HP. Archers can really keep up the heat with stacked AP via PvE 60. Rage generation for all classes isn't a problem anymore with initial clothes boost and said PvE set. Couple this with the new troops which will exacerbate the number of rounds it takes for the DDs to get through them versus knights. Couple *that* with the minimum damage rule (that no amount of PDEF can get around - except dmg reduction). Couple THAT with the standard debuff counters and one could have envisioned a boost was coming.

    Not complaining of course as most archers get nuked into oblivion - until PvE sets come into play as gameplay changes at that point.

    Leave a comment:


  • supermogey
    replied
    Originally posted by Billy_McF View Post
    Heart of Rage - A passive talent that gives a knight +10 to rage after each action

    Divine Blessing - add Pdef and Hp and healing at 20%

    Enhanced Block - Restore HP after every block


    I suggest you research all of these passive talents and the benefits they give you, as they are anti archer talents on the whole.
    that hp healing thing is useless unless i have a mage healing me =P
    the rage thing, I already spoke about that before, it essentially cuts the costs of skills, but no gain from using them, lol

    No what i meant was tell me a way i could increase my patk past the point I had already done it since you were insulting the way i built my knight because i was saying that knights patk was relatively weak. (yes ive done everything i can to increase it)
    You could be right that things will change, im not denying that, but obviously until i see that myself I'm not really going to see that side of it =P

    Leave a comment:


  • Billy_McF
    replied
    [QUOTE=supermogey;486637]
    Originally posted by Billy_McF View Post

    But knoghts can only effectively kill 2 classes with 2 seperate gemming situations. when i said archers could effectively kill 2 classes, i meant that they could do it without having to change gems,

    I asked you to tell me another way of increasing patk excluding all the ways i listed that ive already done (thus pulling as much power out of the knights attack as i could).
    Knights can effectively kill 2 classes by gemming only 1 way.
    Equip Pdef and you can beat archers and other knights. Mages will kill you obviously.
    Archers with pdef equipped only will kill 1 class, Archers, but knights and mages will destroy them. (I know you can't see the knight thing now, but it happens)
    Or they equip Mdef and then they can beat no classes at all, because a mages AOE is too strong for them! And the lack of any Pdef makes them useless against knights or archers. Archers don't have good natural Pdef, it has to be socketed.

    As for increasing the Patk of Knights I thought I did answer that as I indicated it was exactly the same way as for all other classes, there is no way to increase 1 stat that is not available to all classes. All classes have their own starting benefits, but after that they have access to exactly the same methods.
    Last edited by Billy_McF; 03-31-2013, 12:01 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Billy_McF
    replied
    Originally posted by supermogey View Post
    Knights gain rage from 1 attack, their weakest attack, so no knights do not gain rage from all attacks.
    Heart of Rage - A passive talent that gives a knight +10 to rage after each action

    Divine Blessing - add Pdef and Hp and healing at 20%

    Enhanced Block - Restore HP after every block


    I suggest you research all of these passive talents and the benefits they give you, as they are anti archer talents on the whole.
    Last edited by Billy_McF; 03-31-2013, 12:00 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • supermogey
    replied
    [QUOTE=Billy_McF;486631]
    Originally posted by supermogey View Post
    Archers can effectively kill atleast 2 classes with one gem build, provided the knight hasnt gemmed specifically to kill an archer.

    So can knights and mages, that's what I have been trying to explain to you.

    Take a step back, look at my earlier post where I said "I don't know what level you knight is, but if your below 55 then you are going to be at a disadvantage. Once you hit 55-65 then you will start to close the gap rather quickly, then by Lv70 you should be laughing while killing archers that are comparable to you"



    Also i noticed you didnt have an answer to my question, thus it was you who dug yourself a hole by becoming insulting about it....

    So which question did I not answer?

    And try and look at what other people are saying.
    If you build your knight to beat Archers, of course your going to get owned by mages.
    If you build to beat mages your going to be owned by Archers.

    But that is the same for every class.
    I didnt deny that you could be right about the lvl 55 onwards thing, i even replied saying I would test that by leveling a bit more over the next week.

    But knoghts can only effectively kill 2 classes with 2 seperate gemming situations. when i said archers could effectively kill 2 classes, i meant that they could do it without having to change gems, as in kill 2 classes with one set up which is 100% impossible to do for knights, unless built the way i am, but in the long run, my build fails against those with gear comparible ot mine, tbh, mages with same br as me can kick my *** even with my mdef gems, but thats expected, mages are susposed to beat knights, its the way its always been. lol, but their heal does annoy me a bit, but without it, then dungeons would be impossible, lol

    As for the question i asked, well i asked it as a result of you insulting me about not being able to build my knight properly because i was saying they couldnt hit hard.
    I asked you to tell me another way of increasing patk excluding all the ways i listed that ive already done (thus pulling as much power out of the knights attack as i could).

    Leave a comment:


  • Billy_McF
    replied
    [QUOTE=supermogey;486619]
    Archers can effectively kill atleast 2 classes with one gem build, provided the knight hasnt gemmed specifically to kill an archer.

    So can knights and mages, that's what I have been trying to explain to you.

    Take a step back, look at my earlier post where I said "I don't know what level you knight is, but if your below 55 then you are going to be at a disadvantage. Once you hit 55-65 then you will start to close the gap rather quickly, then by Lv70 you should be laughing while killing archers that are comparable to you"



    Also i noticed you didnt have an answer to my question, thus it was you who dug yourself a hole by becoming insulting about it....

    So which question did I not answer?

    And try and look at what other people are saying.
    If you build your knight to beat Archers, of course your going to get owned by mages.
    If you build to beat mages your going to be owned by Archers.

    But that is the same for every class.
    Last edited by Billy_McF; 03-31-2013, 11:37 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • supermogey
    replied
    Originally posted by R26092269 View Post
    awww man if you re seriously saying that archers neglecting their pdef wont die to all knights then im sorry but you really dont know what your re talking about..
    on a one on one battle between knight and archers with no unit, yes pdef is a must for archers, but when units are in the equation, ive never seen a need for an archer to have much. My whole point on that matter is that knights take a while to get through troops, where as, archers can decimate the knights troops, then start on the knight before he has even made his way to the archer.
    On my server, all the top people are mostly archers and mages, there are a few knights and im included in that. However, the strongest player on our server is a knight, but a heavy cash shop user as well. In saying that, people have started to catch up to him now, well the archers and mages have and thats by putting a fraction of the money into that he did.

    Leave a comment:


  • supermogey
    replied
    Originally posted by Billy_McF View Post
    My god you really need to stop this, you are digging even deeper every time you post.

    Rage build up is never a problem for knights. The problem is the CD on their skills. Knights and mages build rage with each attack. Archers rely on Crit to build rage.

    Knights are the anti-christ of archers..they have the Pdef to counter our Patk, and if you can't fathom that little bit of info out I can't help you any further.
    No offense intended, but you need to stop just replying to each comment and take this whole conversation into concideration. Again Knights can only defend against archers if they reduce themselves to nothing but cannon fodder against mages... Archers can effectively kill atleast 2 classes with one gem build, provided the knight hasnt gemmed specifically to kill an archer.
    Knights gain rage from 1 attack, their weakest attack, so no knights do not gain rage from all attacks. they may not consume all the rage that is required for the attack due to a passive buff that does in effect give rage for each attack as you put it.... but in actual effect all it does is reduce the rage cost a fraction.

    Also i noticed you didnt have an answer to my question, thus it was you who dug yourself a hole by becoming insulting about it....

    I dont need any help from someone who cannot discuss the mechanics of a game without getting emotionally riled up like a pre pubescent little girl (no offense intended to girls...)

    I had an oppinion, i voiced my oppinion just like im entitled too as are you, but to get insulting is only going to result in retaliation and remove any validicity to anything either of us are saying. I wont apologise for in turn insulting you, because to frank, you asked for it with the way you were acting, but from now on, if you wish to continue this debate, please refrain from insults and stick the full conversation, not just your own points.

    Leave a comment:


  • R26092269
    replied
    Originally posted by supermogey View Post
    dieing to other archers maybe, due to the high dmg output, but as i said, knights.... unlikely, a knights dmg is low, rage build up is very slow, their attacks skills are slower, there attack skills cost most of their rage, the only 2 that dont are the rage builder and the one that hits the weakest enemy. it can be a challenge for knights to get past high leveled troops before their health is knocked quite significantly down by archers.
    so no, archers with a bit less pdef will not die to all knights. They would only die to knights who have turned themselves into mage cannon fodder.....
    im looking at this from every angle, yes i kinda forgot about facing off against your own class, but i admitted that, but being able to spec to defeat 2 classes is better than being able to spec to beat 1.
    awww man if you re seriously saying that archers neglecting their pdef wont die to all knights then im sorry but you really dont know what your re talking about..

    Leave a comment:


  • Oxykotton
    replied
    Block isn't a problem really. People say it is "nerfed" but the real answer it was adjusted so that knights wouldn't be god like. Besides if you have a reasonable amount of block 2k+ then you still get a decent amount of blocks there. If you have 3k+block you will start to feel like you did before this patch. Crits are a bit high up there but I believe it compensates for what archers lack(no offense to archers.) bc let's get real here archers at higher lvl arn't too good of a class. They need something to help them against other classes and that's high crit rate. With out crit rate they won't get much rage boost and there dmg will be basically nothing.

    Knights if built right don't have to worry about archers regardless where there block is at. There high hp and high pdef will be able to absorb most hits from archers. The only class that gives real problem to knights are mages but that's how it is suppose to be. No class should be all OP and win everything. Just bc if that were the case there be no reason to play any other class.

    Leave a comment:


  • Billy_McF
    replied
    Originally posted by supermogey View Post
    lol... ok mister informed. tell me how to increase a knights patk past the point of gemming for it, increasing skill level, having the stats on gear and astrals? (ignoring guild skills because everyones differ and ive tested against people in ym guild)
    so unless you have an answer to that question, dont bother reducing yourself to an infants level of debating and outright insulting me.
    Tell me how to increase any stat past those points. I don't think praying works in this game, but I could be wrong.

    I can't increase an archers Patk without doing all of the above, the little bit extra an archer get's in Patk is countered by the extra Pdef a knight gets!

    Leave a comment:


  • Billy_McF
    replied
    My god you really need to stop this, you are digging even deeper every time you post.

    Rage build up is never a problem for knights. The problem is the CD on their skills. Knights and mages build rage with each attack. Archers rely on Crit to build rage.

    Knights are the anti-christ of archers..they have the Pdef to counter our Patk, and if you can't fathom that little bit of info out I can't help you any further.

    Leave a comment:

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