Will R2 ever fix Knight Class??

[EQArtimus]

I have been playing this game for quite some time now -- I have several toons and classes on several servers. My main, and oldest is a Knight though only lvl 64, I find it heart breaking to play so much any more. The biggest complaint is about World Bosses -- Even with full Vouchers, and even switching to Crit build with crit astrals, I can't complete with Archers or Mages for nearly the same amount of Gold and Daru that they get every boss. And thus, I find my Troops falling farther and farther behind, I have trouble keeping up with Astrals because I don't have the same amount of gold to dump as them and I have a hard time even keeping up with Guild skills.

One-on-one, I can stand toe-to-toe with anyone, but as soon as I face their troops, which are usually 5+ levels higher than mine, I can't saw through them with my ONE AOE (whirlwind) that has 25 sec cooldown.

Further problems come with Dungeons ... the purpose for Knights is not really clear anymore ... Archers can have nearly the same HP and Defense AND they get debuffs and slows AND do superior damage. Archers and Mages are necessary for Scattershot and Heals -- Knights are optional.

What the heck is the deal here? Can we get some love from R2?

Sincerely,

Sad knight

[dlch90]

Don't dream of clearing templars with just one WW. Btw i have no problem doing better than a mage with higher dmg than my knight on WB. What's your combo for WB? Dungeons? you're still 64 no problem looking for den party. It's just that as a knight it's harder to look for a DT party but don't forget, your guild is there for a reason.

[Daehawk]

Knights and Mages with similar stats get the same amount of Gold/Daru on the World Boss. Only Archers get more due to action rate and higher crit rate due to abilities having a higher base crit chance.

Knights for dungeons are tanks. They can heal off of blocks, they can shield and absorb damage that would of been 20% of their life, knights gain additional healing from mages. Archers don't get any of that.

Knights are fine, keep playing.

[EQArtimus]

I don't dream of clearing them with one WW. I dream of being on equal footing with other classes. And if you are doing better damage than a Mage, you are probably a LOT higher BR then them. I'm not a noob. I have mages and Archers that have way less gear pulling in far more gold and daru without as much trouble.
60s dungeon is Moon -- and finding party is hard. My server isn't so active - I have to pull from multiple guilds to get groups as I am at the top of the food chain on my server.

You can talk about how oh it works for you, or you can talk about how its actually not balanced ... I would like the classes to be more balanced ... I don't want to have to spend a ton of balans to compete with people similarly geared to me at my level.

[EQArtimus]

Don't talk to me like I don't know what tanks are MENT to do. We get a shield -- 20% more hp ... WOW .. usually not a big factor in dungeon success rate. Or maybe you want to tell me about the big bad sheild we can put around our teammates for damage reduction -- WOW --- one time per encounter...

I play all 3 classes -- I know what Im doing. They are unbalanced as hell. If you don't think so, you probably haven't spent as much time playing each of them as I have.

[darrylim]

Classes are all balanced in their own ways, there is no problem with that. I said i'm doing better than mage with higher dmg than me, what has it got to do with higher BR? Br doesn't do more damage.

[EQArtimus]

... please dont start on block - because they nerfed its benefit for us.

[darrylim]

... please dont start on block - because they nerfed its benefit for us.

There is nothing wrong with block? I'm doing good with 2.6k. I assume yours are below 2k by saying this.

[EQArtimus]

There is nothing "wrong" with block. It is often stated to be a huge benefit for Knights because of passive skill heal - which is not such a huge advantage as it once was.

Lets get clear here: Later in the game, gold becomes VERY important. You want to "keep up" with people you are in same bracket with, you are doing all your dailies, you are trying to upgrade legiondaries, youare certainly fully enchanted, and you need to dump gold (lots) into astrals. As well, you will want to buy legendary stones and mount cards from your guild shop - and you will need to invest also into guild skills. LOTS OF GOLD!
Now, where do we get gold?? World Bosses are the over-and-above the largest source of income for those that can take advantage of it ...

Now, everyone knows Archers have it made here -- there are most often 10 archers in the Top 10 -- at least 8 always.
Mages aren't so well off as Archers, but they don't have to decide to be either Tanks or Damage dealers --- even if they choose to be Healers, they still increase their MATT for healing. They CAN choose to make a crit build if they want since Heals get the benefit of Crit too.
Now Knights .... lets see, do we have good options for just building a DAMAGE class? I mean will a DAMAGE-only knight do same damage as a Damage-built mage? NOPE ... Knight don't have aoes like Mage do ... so that' really isn't a viable option. If we are squishy Knight, what good is that -- who heard of a glass-cannon-knight?
The bottom line, if you are really following is that Knights are in a huge disadvantage when it comes to WB -- and WB is a GAME CHANGER.
Similarly built knight is pretty even head to head with other classes -- but play a Knight and try to stay head-to-head with your bracket, and you will find yourself falling behind from WB disadvantage.
If you are a casual player, you won't notice -- as you aren't trying to "Keep up" with your peers -- but if you are hard-core and not a spender, you WILL notice.

Any case, try logging into a new server these days and see how many knights there are ... you will see that most new servers are dominated by Archers in sheer number ... there is a reason for this. When an existing player decides to start over and commits to being top of his new server, he will not choose a knight to express this.

[Daehawk]

Don't talk to me like I don't know what tanks are MENT to do. We get a shield -- 20% more hp ... WOW .. usually not a big factor in dungeon success rate. Or maybe you want to tell me about the big bad sheild we can put around our teammates for damage reduction -- WOW --- one time per encounter...

I play all 3 classes -- I know what Im doing. They are unbalanced as hell. If you don't think so, you probably haven't spent as much time playing each of them as I have.

Along with Knights Passive Crit Chance Reductions and Additional Damage Reduction Passives. Apollo's one time per encounter? Ah you must of never been to Nightmare modes yet. Make a discussion after you have seen Nightmare Mode MPs.

You've gone from Sad Knight to Angry Knight. It's funny, don't make an open discussion if you don't want anyone to talk or reply to you.

[darrylim]

You obviously know nothing about knight hence the topic title. Complaining about gold? Get more patk. Have you been to 65 MP? Nope. Have you been to 70 MP? Nope. If you think archer is superior to knight, go roll an archer and get rolled by a knight.

P.S Fix your knight, not knight class.

[EQArtimus]

You are still not looking at what I am pointing to. Perhaps you take a dislike to my tone or my language. But facts still remain. And you are arguing a point that I am not even arguing.

I am not really trying to discuss or make a case for side-by-side comparison of same-class, same-level, similarly geared. Perhaps my opening argument was unfocused because I presumed that it would be met with more agreement -- so I will be more rigorous with my point. To wit: Leveling a knight has a huge competitive disadvantage.

I have been in top 10 on my server for long time -- I was eclipsed by people spending thousands of dollars (which I don't have a problem with.) But I find more and more that I can't keep up because of the disadvantage presented by the world boss encounter-reward differential.

To meet this fact, I am considering refining my gear to include crit (which I have NONE now) ... which means I need to reduce some defensive stat ... that would make me less suitable for Tanking. This only to be in a position to get gold and daru to keep up with leveling requirements...

So it would seem, to remain competitive, I need to switch to a build that will make me less useful in the short run. This is something I don't see other classes having to do.

Again, to be clear - I have no difficulties fighting someone my level and similarly power gear -- but keeping up with people is harder.

Respectfully submitted

[darrylim]

Refining your gear to crit is not necessary. Keep some lv4-5 crit gems, a lv4 and higher crit astral and deter astral and you will do fine on WB. With 2k crit on my knight i'm doing crits 90% or higher of the time and do better than pve mages with higher dmg than me. Just keep and use your WOTD for pve and pvp and make a set of crit + deter just for wb and switch around. I'm getting 100-125k gold per round with 17.5k patk, lv5 crit and lv5 deter astral with pvp set the last time i did WB.

[EQArtimus]

FWIW, I can roll Archer I meet face to face in GB. But I try in Arena when they have 5+ levels higher Templars, I can't even touch them. How did their Templars get ahead of mine? I attend all world bosses .. I have experimented with Will Destroyer vs. Sniper ... yet they continue to pull ahead.

Maybe you are suggesting that ... let them pass me now, because when I am 70+ I will stomp them .. but I find that a very distasteful argument when the simple fact is that non-knight classes rake in huge amounts of gold and daru compared to what I can do. And it DOES make a huge difference day after day.

If I didn't care about being in Top 20, this wouldn't be an issue. Of course I roll most people on my server. If I wanted to be just ok, this would be a moot point.

Explain one thing please ... for those that are seeing me as some kind of whiner -- which I am not... How come there are so few knights on top-10 WB board? I play on 3 different servers - and I rarely see more than one. And that One is always a heavy balan spender. This seems to happen after passing the 50+ mark for average level on the server. And I have no problem placing on top 10 with my mage or Archer -- both of which, I spend far less time and effort on.

If you can't explain this, then try to explain to me how it is that gold ISN'T a big deal especially later in game?

Again, with respect,

Arty

[darrylim]

I'm not playing on your server so i've got no idea how good are your server's knight. I've played on few servers so far 2-3 knights are always on top 10 WB board and i'm one of them. And btw, i use only 50% on voucher, lv4 patk pot and no rev. If your patk is close to them, it shouldn't be a problem for you to be on top 10 if you're doing double hits with the right combo.

If your troops are not on the same level as you then i have some questions.

1. Are you just rushing levels and not leveling your HS? If you're leveling your HS, there's no way you can't catch up and get your troops to your level.
2. Are you using 50% on vouchers + pot during WB?
3. What's the atk difference between you and those always who are always on the top 10 board?
4. Are you double hitting with a good combo on WB?