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Ethics vs. Tactics

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  • Ethics vs. Tactics

    An incident in GB today prompts me to ask: "How does your guild weigh the ends used to achieve the means in GB?"

    I think we're all familiar with the idea that spawn-camping is tactically smart but ethically kind of a ♥♥♥♥ thing to do in GB. Today, for the first time that I've seen in our server, a lower-strength guild brought in players from a higher-strength guild and used them to help turn the GB in their favor, ultimately winning. While I can't deny that this is a "smart" thing to do...is it "right"? Your thoughts on it, please.

    EDIT: The players were specifically brought in just for the GB, and returned to their guild afterwards. Also, the players brought in/guild bringing them in had, shall we say, personal motivations to do so.
    Last edited by MemoryLane; 10-18-2013, 08:54 PM.

  • #2
    Q.Q get over it

    Comment


    • #3
      Its a ♥♥♥♥ thing to do but R2 doesn't care even though it could be applied under harassment.

      Its not a rule against it, so really nothing to be done for it.
      Last edited by MemoryLane; 10-18-2013, 08:54 PM.
      My name itself is a flame...sweeeeeet! awesome! epic!

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      • #4
        It used to be a Rule, until R2 removed it because it was too much work on enforcing it.

        If you really really hate Spawn Camping, move to playing on AeriaGame server (they still have rule there, they're dedicated to their players first before money - tho they also support P2W aspects in their games)



        As for "high level players"...is the lowbie guild a sister-type guild to the high guild? Since if you didn't get kicked out by an officer, you would have to wait 24 hours before you can rejoin.

        Did they have some sort of deal for that?


        Personally... I think it sucks, but you can't really do anything about it.

        Just like how some players were transfered Guild Master before CW, so they can use the +100 stat mount (which actually adds quite a bit)
        (400 atk, 400 pdef, 400 mdef, 2000 HP), this itself is a level 4+ wing.
        Give it to a Heavy Casher, and they'll gain way more than 400 from the % bonuses.

        Comment


        • #5
          How is spawn camping a smart thing to do? You'd be much better off endlessly bashing WT, no?
          Rivx - 66 Mage (78k BR) / 38 Archer (21k BR) @ Kabam S32 |
          Games: Dota 2, SC II, Dark Souls, Skyrim, WoW, D3, PoE

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by bshallc2010 View Post
            An incident in GB today prompts me to ask: "How does your guild weigh the ends used to achieve the means in GB?"

            I think we're all familiar with the idea that spawn-camping is tactically smart but ethically kind of a ♥♥♥♥ thing to do in GB. Today, for the first time that I've seen in our server, a lower-strength guild brought in players from a higher-strength guild and used them to help turn the GB in their favor, ultimately winning. While I can't deny that this is a "smart" thing to do...is it "right"? Your thoughts on it, please.

            EDIT: The players were specifically brought in just for the GB, and returned to their guild afterwards. Also, the players brought in/guild bringing them in had, shall we say, personal motivations to do so.
            Clarification: It was 3 members who asked to join which hardly makes any difference to a win/lose and the guild was higher level before they joined. But hey it is Wartune and not Farmville hun Besides other guilds seem to be doing the same.

            So yes...in that case: Ethics vs Tactics...Good Question . After consulting with various players in various other guilds including the other guild who lost on this topic the scale seems to tip to good tactics. Having said that, I hardly think that any guild can say that members have not spawn camped....I agree Its a ♥♥♥♥ thing to do in GB.
            Last edited by MemoryLane; 10-18-2013, 08:54 PM.
            GodsofWar Guild Master
            Char: Gizella on S222
            From Sunny South Africa

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            • #7
              Guildhopping is "unethical" but not against the rules.

              Up to your own guildmaster to implement it.
              Officially retired from Wartune and Forums.
              [No longer logging in]

              Comment


              • #8
                I say its smart, but if 3 players make that much difference try recruiting more.

                As for the personal motives, people seem to act like children on this game, making childish arguments up, causing drama, and generally getting their little panties in a twist. I pride myself on sticking with my core group of friends, i go where they go. We accept no drama, as those who start it usually have serious RL self conscious issues and need a good spanking.

                Just remember if things get personal, report them. This game doesn't need drama, we are here to have fun times xD and laugh at people who cry about cashers when without them there would be no game to play xD

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by d07.RiV View Post
                  How is spawn camping a smart thing to do? You'd be much better off endlessly bashing WT, no?
                  Spawn Camping as a tactic theoretically allows you a clearer shot at the Ward Tower since it confines the opposing side to their spawn point and does not allow them to "block" their ward. Before the "Attack" button was added to Ward Tower simply by having a group of characters surround your ward tower not only could you slow down your opponents by getting into combat, you could make it almost impossible for them to click on the Ward in the first place. A lot of the smaller guilds on my server were using the "blocking" tactic to delay their defeat so they could get slightly higher rewards. To counter it, when I was still in Misfits, we would have 5 of our Top 10 camp the opponents Spawn to try and keep them inside and away from their Ward. Since the changes "blocking is only really productive if you have a LOT of Participants and using morph cards to present a smaller target to "blockers" is the preferred tactic on our server now.
                  Patryn
                  Twisted
                  S130 Dragonmar

                  "If you can't take brutal honesty then you are speaking to the wrong person"
                  "Touring S130....one guild at a time"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I think it's an intelligent tactic, but it's also fairly unsportsmanlike (not necessarily unethical). It's akin to what happened with my company's inter-office basketball league.

                    We had our teams, and my office had won the last 3 championship (The NY/NJ office). So one of the managers in the Philly office calls in a favor to some distant college friend and they hired as a "contractor" - just in time for the basketball championship - Mark Jackson. The Mark Jackson that would be drafted in the 2nd round by the Golden State Warriors. 6'10" Mark Jackson.

                    It wasn't even fair - we got wrecked.

                    Now technically they didn't break any rules. They legitamately processed him through HR for a 72-hour contract. All on the up and up. They were serious and wanted to win.

                    But it was probably the most cheesy and hollow victory I've ever seen.

                    That's pretty much the same thing this guild did to you.

                    The solution is this: Players aren't eligible to join a GB until they've been in the guild for 3 days. If R2 could configure that restriction, or 7Road were to code it in, it'd pretty much solve it.

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                    • #11
                      For me it's agaisn't my own ethics.

                      but afterall, a guild battle is a war between two guilds, and war means something else on it's own, even on games.
                      Character name: Silence

                      Class: mage.

                      Server: 490.

                      Level 44.

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                      • #12
                        The interesting thing about this, is that only 3 players asked to come over of their own accord. On top of that, those three players could not have possibly have affected the outcome of the battle that much. If anything they only managed to reduce the time it took to defeat your guild. Superior tactics were used not ringers. Another point that I would like to bring up is that the guild that won is also ranked higher than the guild that lost. Prior to the guild battle.
                        Last edited by R2486166; 10-19-2013, 06:21 AM.

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                        • #13
                          There was also a statement that it was a lower guild I think you need to look at the rankings, the winners are level 3 in the GB rankings I believe that yours is number 4 seems to be that the win was going to happen whether the other 3 players were there or not.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            What saddens me is that this has turned into a political discussion and that there are entities now trying to take out the fun that everyone had in this most talked about GB. It is the opinion that GOW would have lost if those 3 players did not join the battle. Give us some credit peeps. I was battling my heart out in that battle and it was so much fun. It is the opinion of all that was there - as far as I heard. Accept offcourse those that are sour about losing against GOW. Hell how did this happen??? they ask. Many out there wrote GOW off the charts. Left the guild because GOW will not make it. Well guess what, we are still here and we won that GB. We had many members in that battle that fought with all they had. Dont take the glory from all of GOW that fought there just cause you dont like losing.

                            Come on people losing is just an event - its in your hands to change the future events.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              There are 2 ways to counter spawn killers
                              1) Send the lowbies to attack them thus keeping them occupied
                              2) If all other guilds agree with you, when in GB, all stay in camp and do not engage in combat. That way any guild that "cheats" (even though typically it is NOT cheating, only unsportsmanship) won't have fun in GB.

                              PS. If there are too many monster spawn killers you will probably lose battle anyway, so pray they delay in destroying ward and you get more reward.

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