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IRIS Sylph Balance Issues - Critical Heals are Broken.

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  • IRIS Sylph Balance Issues - Critical Heals are Broken.

    Hello All,

    As a Mage, I find the current use of Iris (by Archers in-particular) quite offensive. Their innate Critical Boost and baseline Critical Spec makes their use of Iris almost ludicrous. I have fought Archers that are healing themselves for 100,000+ HP with Critical Iris Heals. Some Knights, with their Innate Boost on Healing Received are self-Healing w/ Iris for over 120,000 HP. This is absolutely ludicrous! Not only has it made battling them about as close to a no-win as one can get, it's also completely removed the need for Mages in PvE. When 3 Archers w/ Iris Sylphs can do Lych Lair by themselves, something is wrong.

    Healing, for ANY class, should NOT be subject to Critical Hits - and if it IS to remain so, I would petition that Will Destroyer ALSO affect Healing. Critical Healing via Iris is forcing every Mage to change over to Critical Builds in hopes they can equal what an Archer does and get lucky with a Big Heal to stay in a fight longer. Unfortunately, Mages don't get the Critical Boost, so they can never really match them.

    So I'd like to request one or more of the 3 following things to balance this:
    • Remove Critical Hits from Healing Spells, OR
    • Allow Will Destroyer Astral(s) to affect Healing AND Add a Critical Enhancement Talent in place of Misfortune (who NO ONE uses) so that a Mage can gain innate Critical %. (Keeping both Will Destroyer and Critical Paths viable for Mages) OR
    • Update the Mage Skill Healing Empowerment from 4% / 8% (pointlessly low now) to 35% / 70%


    I feel one of these three are necessary because it used to be that Mages did the least damage, but at least we were the best healers. Now we do the least damage _and_ we're effectively the worst healers when confronted w/ an Archer or Knight w/ an Iris Sylph. It ain't right.
    Last edited by Zorich; 12-07-2013, 10:27 PM.

  • #2
    When a knight or an archer complained about BL being OP, mages laughed.
    When mages ruled mid to high BG because of all the heals (suntoria/restoration/BL), mages said "everything is ok, get your toon fixed".
    Mages are still better healers in pve (their skills don't need the transform time) BUT they did lose their HUGE advantage in pvp.
    So in a (bizzarre) way, this OP skill balanced pvp.
    And I didn't hear you complain about the unscatterable apollo shield that Pan provides.

    Iris rain dance IS OP, but so is BL.

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    • #3
      Zorich,

      Critical heals for archers trigger all too often for archers, if they build their toon right.
      Officially retired from Wartune and Forums.
      [No longer logging in]

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      • #4
        I've said it before and I'll say it again, the Sylph system is the biggest nerf to the mage class we've ever seen. This is just icing on the cake.
        [US West S6 Duskin Arena] [Moloch] [Level 70] [Battle Rating 105k] [Lord Divine] [Critical Mage] [Guild: United Soul]
        [60 Armor] [70 jewels] [60 rings]

        Miracles Do Happen

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        • #5
          Originally posted by MolochMage View Post
          I've said it before and I'll say it again, the Sylph system is the biggest nerf to the mage class we've ever seen. This is just icing on the cake.
          true, its not just about the heal they received, they also received the aoe to destroy the troops fast, all they lack now is mages suntoria

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          • #6
            Originally posted by ArowenGR View Post

            Iris rain dance IS OP, but so is BL.
            Yeah BL is OP, it costs huge amount of rage. XD

            When archers ruled BG early game they didn't complain, and when they have it difficult mid game they screamed and complained. When knights rule endgame they didn't complain and when had it difficult early game, cried and complained. This is with or without sylph.

            What is the cooldown of rain dance vs BL? Anyone knows?
            Wartune = Sylph Tune.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Draggyy View Post
              true, its not just about the heal they received, they also received the aoe to destroy the troops fast, all they lack now is mages suntoria
              Agree, and I know some archers/knights who even still want another AOE skills because mages still has 2 AOE. They think all mages skill should be added to the other classes, smh. Imagine, with the 2 physical attackers high hp, they can still heal a lot, and will not consume rage.
              Last edited by MaccteN001; 12-08-2013, 07:46 AM.
              Wartune = Sylph Tune.

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              • #8
                ..............

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by MaccteN001 View Post
                  Yeah BL is OP, it costs huge amount of rage. XD

                  When archers ruled BG early game they didn't complain, and when they have it difficult mid game they screamed and complained. When knights rule endgame they didn't complain and when had it difficult early game, cried and complained. This is with or without sylph.

                  What is the cooldown of rain dance vs BL? Anyone knows?
                  *** are u at with huge amount of rage its only cost 60 rage for almost a half hp heal so tell me 1 more time if it cost much with ur 3 aoe attack to max 3rage

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                  • #10
                    Why the fuss?
                    Archers/knights get BL and an extra aoe, mages get (unscatterable) apollo shield.

                    Pve balance is the same (except that knights and archers can also help heal/puri).
                    Pve is equally balanced. Pvp has gotten more interesting. Now there is no universally strong sylph, all have strengths and weaknesses.

                    Aren't mages better suited to deal with iris and apollo cause of high MDEF? The 2 strongest (maybe) sylph are not very effective vs mages but destroy knights and archers.
                    Mages also got an extra MATK delphic pvp skill that whips knights and archers but they are not happy. Why? Because they prefer Pan since it is better in class wars.

                    Now is not about class and not about sylph.
                    Each combination of class and skill has different strengths and weaknesses

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                    • #11
                      1 bl to counter first brut+lunatic/whirlwind was fine even if lunatic/whirlwind still have better cd...but now Apollo 2 aoe u might even die than if they don't switch to normal form and Delphic us.Mages are squishy and Templars are only thing that stands between us and huge amount of dmg from archer/knight delph or similar.
                      And totally agree with previous comments.... rain of dance from iris no rage consume plus much more % heal than bl,and its crazy what archers do to us with Apollo aoe(as I said mages are squishy would gladly trade %mdef passive for %pdef passive better counter 2 classes than 1,plus no 20%hp passive like those 2 classes)

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                      • #12
                        Mages = Have heals, we need apollo
                        Knights = massive hp, take iris, and if you die, you have built your char wrong!
                        Archers = Take iris, and if you don't rule the game, you have built your char so bad!

                        I would like to see either that crit base is taken from the sylph only, or that heals can't be crit.

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                        • #13
                          knights and archers even with iris or apollo its hard to kill a mage with a high mdef, and mage use iris or apollo to increase their matk... of course a mage with iris which has the heal area and with their suntoria are inkillable...

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by ArowenGR View Post
                            Why the fuss?
                            Archers/knights get BL and an extra aoe, mages get (unscatterable) apollo shield.

                            Pve balance is the same (except that knights and archers can also help heal/puri).
                            Pve is equally balanced. Pvp has gotten more interesting. Now there is no universally strong sylph, all have strengths and weaknesses.

                            Aren't mages better suited to deal with iris and apollo cause of high MDEF? The 2 strongest (maybe) sylph are not very effective vs mages but destroy knights and archers.
                            Mages also got an extra MATK delphic pvp skill that whips knights and archers but they are not happy. Why? Because they prefer Pan since it is better in class wars.

                            Now is not about class and not about sylph.
                            Each combination of class and skill has different strengths and weaknesses
                            yes we have scatter and apollo but, apollo is not as effective on mages because we are the class with the lowest hp, as for scatter yes, only for pve and if you have money to buy it. Never met someone who uses scatter in pvp for anything else except for suntoria, and suntoria is the only thing sylph didn't gave you.
                            In pvp yes, for now the strongest is matk but you do forget an aspect of the game, mages hides behind troops, troops which are jsut lvl 50 thier for now and that has low mdef. Lets say a mage battles an archer/knight all with apollo which is so weak against mages, the knights/archers uses aoe, awaken , and the 2 aoe spells then unsylph. what just happened? it became a 1 vs 1 battle! no troops, and the archer/knight are building their rage for their ultimate which shall probably come after the 50% boost.
                            What I am trying to say is that apollo is not used to kill the mage but to clear his walls (troops) after which they can 1 hit the mage with delphic, and no, we can't kill them before the 50% boost We dont have the aoe advantage anymore because now the troops can be cleared fast by everyone.

                            p.s. I talked from a bg point of view since that si the place where we usually battle, and people can come with the sylph prepared to be awakened

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Draggyy View Post
                              yes we have scatter and apollo but, apollo is not as effective on mages because we are the class with the lowest hp, as for scatter yes, only for pve and if you have money to buy it. Never met someone who uses scatter in pvp for anything else except for suntoria, and suntoria is the only thing sylph didn't gave you.
                              In pvp yes, for now the strongest is matk but you do forget an aspect of the game, mages hides behind troops, troops which are jsut lvl 50 thier for now and that has low mdef. Lets say a mage battles an archer/knight all with apollo which is so weak against mages, the knights/archers uses aoe, awaken , and the 2 aoe spells then unsylph. what just happened? it became a 1 vs 1 battle! no troops, and the archer/knight are building their rage for their ultimate which shall probably come after the 50% boost.
                              What I am trying to say is that apollo is not used to kill the mage but to clear his walls (troops) after which they can 1 hit the mage with delphic, and no, we can't kill them before the 50% boost We dont have the aoe advantage anymore because now the troops can be cleared fast by everyone.

                              p.s. I talked from a bg point of view since that si the place where we usually battle, and people can come with the sylph prepared to be awakened
                              When the knights had to deal with 70+ HP templars, you mages were laughing.
                              Mages can't be the OP class forever

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