Guild battles 16-8 alternative

[Patyfatycake]

Note: I am unsure about why the guild count is being reduced although I can speculate.

What is Happening:

R2 games is currently reducing the number of competing guilds in the weekly guild battles from 16 guilds to 8 guilds.

Why:

Edit: Had a chat with a GM on 137

Lewis: Are you trying to reduce the number of guilds to force them to go into higher guilds and fight each other?
R2Ares: that one way to look at it
R2Ares: its also to make the smaller guild more competive to take part in it
Lewis: When they can flock to the higher guilds, would it not be better to lower the amount of members possible in a guild?
R2Ares: but then they can merge together and take on a larger guild

Please note this is my assumption The main reason I believe that this is happening is due to the power difference between the top 8 guilds and the top 16 guilds. The top 16 guilds are just not able to even phase the top 16 guilds which makes it an unpleasant event for the lower teams competing although rewarding.

The problem:
Due to the number of guilds participating in guild battles being reduced guilds will swarm to the top 8. This is also stated in this thread by BlackJackel. A summary of his post is that the guilds will swarm to the top and still not be aloud to compete in guild battles because there is no alternative. His solution is to cut the number of members aloud in a guild to fix this by forcing them to split into different guilds to compete.

Swarming: The guilds which do not swarm the top guilds will be falling further behind because they have no capability of keeping up with the large sum honour and insignia which the guild battles provide the guilds.

Gaming Lag: Many people already experience lag, playres to participate in 8 different guild battles will force those guild battles which happen to be even laggier due to more participants being in the same area. The smaller guild battles cater to the players which do not have the capacity to load such squished battles to still participate in the event.

PVP Imbalance: As Mormegil666 stated guilds that are not part of the top 8 will reduce significantly disadvantage due to the medallion advantage other players will have over them.

The Solution:
My solution would incorporate his idea(Although possible without) his idea.

1. Having seperate divisions: The general idea would be to incorporate the idea of splitting them like the current system does(First round divides the top 8 and 9-16 etc). Instead of the first round being the pummeling from the best guild versue the 16th guild why not just bypass that round? Monday the first rounds are between 1-8 and 9-16. This removes the need for the lower guilds to take a beating from the stronger guilds and makes it more enjoyable and closer for all guilds that are currently participating. Following this logic we could have it all the way to top 32(Depending on how many guilds are in the server of course).
2. Reducing the number of members in a guild: This is following BlackJackel's idea of reducing the number of members in a guild forcing there to be more competition between guilds, this will make the top 8 truly something to fight over and could have guilds participating in it changing weekly. This will force guilds to remove inactive members and only keep active members if they want an opportunity to win it.
3. Reallocation of prizes(WickedSilk): Instead of having the Guild battles having such a vast reward we should reallocate it to another area of the game such as battlegrounds. This will help reduce the people swarming due to less rewards.
4. Seperate division(Alternate by dragon922 ): Multiple brackets for Guild Battles. In fact, let's expand on that a bit, let's make 1-8 battle as planned, same rewards as normal, 9-16 the same. No differences in Insignias, Honor, or Whips gained, or the rest. Since battling is proposed to end on Friday, then whoever wins out of each bracket may on Saturday face one another for a sort of "Champion of Champions" prize pool. Simple, effective, promoting both balance and growth, exciting players into working hard to potentially become "giant-killers" as it were.

[traumatise]

+1 for the post good job and also the idea of wickedsilk is good, hope managers will listen to the costumers...

[Urko_]

They will kill al guilds, they want guilds with more than 200 members, this is crazy, and if you are not in one of these guilds, you can be competitive, and not for honor. Guild battles are the only way to gain soul cristals and mount training whips, so we couldn't raise mount. This is really the worst idea for this great game. Many players will left the game if this restriction continues. For me if i leave it, i won't make a new char in a newer server, i will go to another game.

[dwmedia]

Is bad go down to only 8 why not go down to only top 2 guilds.

At S100 is a max 2 guilds people for a battel other guilds is 0 to 2 some show up.
hire in this forum was same probs at S18.

So its not nessery have so many guild for is no people for get 8 guild.


Wartune make for many server so them split up. S100 have max 100 activa players i guess.
And them all are in one singel guild.

We have non to fight.

[R26031681]

This new system screws a lot of players. GB is one of the few ways to get honor and insignias. I played on one server where I was late to the server and was a low level player and got in the top guild. I could never get into GB's though because they always had 50+ much higher level players who wanted to participate. I left the server as I couldn't progress that way and the GB was at a bad time for me.

On the server I'm on I'm one of the top 50 players on the server so I get into whatever battle I want. But we have well over 100 players in our guild and we routinely have several players who want to get into battle but who can't. This is with 16 guilds that can participate. If you go down to less guilds that will put more people into fewer guilds meaning fewer and fewer people can participate. That won't affect me but I feel bad for the numerous low level players who are now under a severe disadvantage.

i like the ideas presented here. If guild battles are limited to 50 participants then it doesn't make a ton of sense to have 300 people in the guild. That is a lot of people who can't participate. Those same people can't get insigs to buy PVP gear which means they will have more trouble in BG, thereby not getting many insigs or honor there either. Bad idea R2. Bad idea

[EVOAUDREY]

Also we are still limited to 50 participants. less guilds abe to play=more ppl crying for gb slots....uncool wartune

[dwmedia]

Only resone is BG is not cross-side

is not enogut of good players for get 16 strong Guild.
Many guild need to merg me with other for catch up a top 3 guilds.

in S100 is only 2 guild some are strong all other is afk.
Them have start marg now so its soon 3 strong guilds.

But before we put a moive or TV show and go afk after we take defens at tower and we winning is for weak.
Its not fun play vs afk team.

And them should not earn some insigines to

i want to see Top 100 guilds and Cross-side so man can meet every top guilds frome every singel server.
Should be hard core more fun and more action.

And every singel server should put every singel of top players in the top guild

Should be like OS. Olympics games

[R25401441]

Simple fix

A solution for the guild battle issues would be like many have said.... to have two different divisions of guild battle. One of the reasons that have been suspected for the reduction in number of guilds able to participate is because of lag... well... have the 1-8 guild division, and the 9-16 division battle on alternate days. this would eliminate the lag issue as not all would be in the same arena at once. They have already reduced the number of battles per week down to 3, so this would work nicely.

The only thing they would have to account for is guild jumpers... so if a person fought in a gb one night and then left their guild (whether quit or got booted) they would not be able to join another gb until the second day.... or alternatively... simply limit a persons guild battle attempts to 3 per week. if they want to jump guilds to do guild battle 3 days in a row.. they would just have to sit it out for the rest of the week until Sunday when the rankings were determined and the attempt count could be reset. This would be convenient for people with hectic schedules as well as it is sometimes difficult to be online in time to attend certain scheduled events.

As a fairly powerful member of a leading guild in my server I get the opportunity to join guild battle all the time. But I can see already that it has, and will continue to extend the gap between the high level guilds and the low level ones. there will be alot of people simply quitting because they are not eligible for rewards that are not bought with money, but simply only offered to only some players on the server for free.

Please keep our servers active.. don't force the smaller guilds out.. if the servers die out it will just be more work for the developers to merge more servers.. which will cause a loss of paying players each merge.. which will equal loss of revenue.


HEED MY WORD- FOR I AM THE KING OF ALL YOU SEE BEFORE YOU... (until my wife gets home)

[Mormegil666]

samething happened to us Leandro.... and i think my choise will be to die with my guild lol
this is so funny human nature

[Leandro.RPG]

Wartune is DEAD for me.




Reading that post i only can say, one thing, since they wanna KILL all guilds to make only 8 guilds, i am leaving the game and stopping give money to r2games, i will list here why i got that decision.

1° my guild was top 4 on S33 Server Undead Pit;
2° After Server merge my guild dropped to rank 20th losing the right of joining in a guild battle.
3° Suffered to make my guild rank 13th to join again in a guild battle
4° After that they got lots of lv 60+ and then these high lvs started stealing our Gold mines.
5° Battleground lose the fun after lv 40, how can a mere lv 40 fight a lv 70? they are farming on us
6° Now the new update will destroy all work that i made to make my guild strong enough for fight in guild battle
7° if they don't give option for a guild battle between 9~16, 17~24 rank guilds, i am quitting the game for sure and ceasing my subscription vip payment.



How to say the dictate in my city: "Everything that is good, tough little"

[R24877577]

Lewis: Are you trying to reduce the number of guilds to force them to go into higher guilds and fight each other?
R2Ares: that one way to look at it
R2Ares: its also to make the smaller guild more competive to take part in it
Lewis: When they can flock to the higher guilds, would it not be better to lower the amount of members possible in a guild?
R2Ares: but then they can merge together and take on a larger guild

He also stated that they read the forums so keep stating your opinion because it will help them make their decision/gather feedback.

The sad part is this is not what has happened since the guild battle system was introduced. Sure one or two smaller guilds will merge to fight the bigger guilds but in most cases they will just get acquired by the top 2 guilds making them stronger and stronger and stomping on the other guilds more easily. This is what I have seen happen since the beginning of S61 and even after the server merge with S58 over the past couple of weeks where one powerhouse guild is already emerging from other big 3 and acquired one of the smaller guilds to aid in their quest to be top. Lowering the participants would alleviate this problem a great deal I believe as players want to be able to participate so it will force the power to be more spread out. The participants list is far too high to fill up 8 guilds on my server at least. Like I said above as the second strongest guild we were topping out at 35-37 and often had less than 30 in our guild battles. Far too much room for a top guild to acquire more players and become overly dominant. The only problem with lowering the participants list is it would break up my guild and it would be difficult to say goodbye to members of my family like that.

For other servers I have seen players complain about guilds not being able to part of the system so clearly they have more competitive and active guilds than on my server so their needs are different. I hope some system can be found that will be a suitable compromise for the different needs of the servers. This could be a step in the right direction, and it will be interesting to see how it turns out.

[R24877577]

Haven't read much of this thread yet but this is how I feel about the guild battle change. The system is a blanket system for every server and with such different set ups guild wise between servers it is frankly impossible to find one that works for every server.


I like reducing the number of days as the game is very time demanding as it is to remain competitive. Keeping Saturday night free is a definite plus for me. I am in a server that recently merged with another and there are 4 major guilds, 2 from each server and a couple others that can put out some numbers. My entire server is tired of the no shows and having to go afk or just attack the ward tower over and over. Last week was the first week of battles after the merge and we had 2 no show battles (one had 5 players in it but less leveled) and 2 real fights. My guild came third. For my guild we get about 35-40 people show up to battles. This means the cap is too high as if the third strongest guild leaves so much room then that makes it too much room for players to swarm the top guilds and create an imbalance. There already has been guilds merging to the top one creating a heavier imbalance in power. It was even worse before the server merge. The little guilds would die out or merge ever since the guild battle was introduced.

I have a slower cpu so the lag is horrible and after 10 or 15minutes I have to relog which becomes quite troublesome but this is my issue and not as big of a deal to everyone but lowering the number of players from 50 to about 35 would be much more ideal for my server and perhaps guilds would break off into more guilds filling up the 8 slots. This would spread out the power more and hopefully one guild would not be so dominant. I cannot speak for other servers but from what I have heard some have more than 8 major guilds so this is difficult for them.

[Patyfatycake]

Well, Ares, can you explain how this will make them more competitive? As quite a few of the top guilds have to not allow member into guild battle. This will cause more players to flood into the top 8 guilds and have yet more players not participating. If the objective is to be more competitive, then I would recommend reading the suggestion here or this one here.

To OP: wonderful thread thank you.

Without stating what is meant by "more competitive" this is a null answer and means about as much as shoes to snakes.
My PERSONAL OPINION is that the objective is to slowly shrink the number of guilds. This will force more players into top guilds, which will require more use of cash to improve the toon so it can be used in GB.

Let us face it if your in the super guild, unless your a top player you are not getting into the guild battle. The easiest way to be top player is more cash spent on the game.

Now, I will not nor ever say a word against any company making money, that IS the objective of the company. However, this idea seems like a bad one, yes a few players MAY spend more, but more and more of the F2P will leave the game, then it is reduced to just the cashers playing, which then gets boring to them, and then they leave, then the game dies.

Thanks, I did have a private chat to him although I do not wish to post all of it because it was a private chat(Unsure if he would mind me posting it).

Lewis: Are you trying to reduce the number of guilds to force them to go into higher guilds and fight each other?
R2Ares: that one way to look at it
R2Ares: its also to make the smaller guild more competive to take part in it
Lewis: When they can flock to the higher guilds, would it not be better to lower the amount of members possible in a guild?
R2Ares: but then they can merge together and take on a larger guild

He also stated that they read the forums so keep stating your opinion because it will help them make their decision/gather feedback.

[StevenDeschain]

Well, Ares, can you explain how this will make them more competitive? As quite a few of the top guilds have to not allow member into guild battle. This will cause more players to flood into the top 8 guilds and have yet more players not participating. If the objective is to be more competitive, then I would recommend reading the suggestion here or this one here.

To OP: wonderful thread thank you.

Without stating what is meant by "more competitive" this is a null answer and means about as much as shoes to snakes.
My PERSONAL OPINION is that the objective is to slowly shrink the number of guilds. This will force more players into top guilds, which will require more use of cash to improve the toon so it can be used in GB.

Let us face it if your in the super guild, unless your a top player you are not getting into the guild battle. The easiest way to be top player is more cash spent on the game.

Now, I will not nor ever say a word against any company making money, that IS the objective of the company. However, this idea seems like a bad one, yes a few players MAY spend more, but more and more of the F2P will leave the game, then it is reduced to just the cashers playing, which then gets boring to them, and then they leave, then the game dies.

[R26981785]

People are already jumping ship from the guild i am in for the bigger one's when we in the pass have beaten them before, with people leaving other's are like, well there goes that, and i dont want to join another guild.....log off for good...lost $$