Priest should change!

[Alexmancer]

The only relevant discussions and points we are trying to make come from pages 1 2 and 3

I've poster relevant, useful content on other pages.

[Shaoren]

Priest are OP as hell idk what you're talkin about

are you sure priest is OP and OP on what point?
is your main priest?
what lv your priest is? above 80?
did you ever PVP someone? did you ever PVP someone that above 80?

[kimberlyc]

The only relevant discussions and points we are trying to make come from pages 1 2 and 3

[crxleader]

Priest are OP as hell idk what you're talkin about

[Alexmancer]

I don't get why people don't understand that end blood priests are weak. Where is Renfa when you need him?

[MissKimmer]

If you look closely at every skill there is for a blood priest.. it says a certain % of matk.. matk = int.. without int.. blood priests are weak

[Salvo]

A: This has been tested many times before the amount of damage you lose by not going full int simply isn’t worth the ~8k hp you gain by going full end(you actually lose dmg because hp doesn’t translate to bonus BB damage well.) Math for bonus BB dmg from HP below.
1: Full int: ~100k hp
~1a: 100,000/100= 1,000
~1b: 1,000*4.5= 4,500 bonus dmg on BB
2: Full end: ~108k hp
~2a: 108,000/100= 1,080
~2b: 1,080*4.5= 4860 bonus dmg on BB
So you’re going to trade ~3k+ attack from going full int(at lvl 100) for ~360 more dmg on blood beam?

who said it full INT? read the post carefully. i said for holy its 2:1 not full int (3:0)
for blood its full End 3:0

[Sidoh]

throwing my two sense in here o.o at 70% damage reduction (damn caps...there shouldn't be any in the first place) i still get 60k+ crits on me in seng from mages with roughly 9k matk outside seng similar to shadow's stats actually. granted my hp is kinda of low (went str instead of endurance knight...patk from it at the point i'm at more beneficial to boost me pve to actually get stronger before i switch to endurance), 70% matk damage reduct shouldn't be able to hit 60k+ and 2 shot me. something's kinda of wrong there...and thats when we look at the fire mages builds. meteor is commonly maxed (i think) as well as the flame explosion. level 5 flame explosion gives you nearly 100% + extra matk worth of damage. so 10k matk = like 22k+ damage = ~30k lucky strike = up to 75k with 250% crit damage, mages usually have higher end crit rates and hit % can be obtained in huge bulk from guild skills along with an easy 40% more cast speed by the time you hit slayers levels. this makes flame explosion cast pretty fast.

now, i will point some things out with mage skills and how they are broken. my test mage has 30 armor pen outside seng, and 8% ignore defense proc chance. removing all my dummy mage's gear she has 1.6k matk and deals 1 damage to me. over the course of 30 minutes outside seng, she dealt a max of 250 damage on lucky strikes from luck hits on crit, never ignored defense regardless of the 8% magic def ignore proc rate and armor penetration. So mages themselves do have broken skills. if the mage had ignored my defense or armor penetrated, there should be something along the lines of 2k damage dealt eventually...but never did defense ignoring actually occur. i firmly believe armor penetration, and pen resistance only work in sengolia, as level 30 knights can sometimes land a 10k crit with pure luck. as for critical defense, i feel it's a broken stat and i've never encountered changes no matter how much of that i add on.

now on to pvp with priest. i'll say this...hybrids always give me the most trouble. they can use all the skills of a blood priest but have healing abilities, the passive 10% heal and the buffs. scion buffs in seng can really make or break someone...usually the scion buffed knights are a pain in the rear to take out. i've had some friends of mine go the full blood route...they quickly changed back to hybrid because they died too fast and couldn't land kills kiting like they could before as they lacked back-up healing. hybrids = best in my opinion and experiences. my issue with priest...is they lack the most spammable skills and mostly rely on DoT's which aren't too hard to escape from with minimal damage. blood priest had nice blood beam (damage not constant) and hybrids have access to 2 instant cast skills spirit infusion and blood pact (both hit hard but usually not hard enough), but overall thats it...and they'll be lucky to have killed someone by the time they finish spamming their 2 skills and the person either ran away or the priest will have already died....only reasons priest gives me grief right now is due to 2k ms ping from satellite net. anyone with lags will dread priests their rooting when you start to jump all over the screen.

Knights and rogues have their own equal share of troubles. Knights skills will almost always fail if players move fast. means we can't hit anyone unless they stand still for a second. crucify and dragon hook (even level 5) has chances to miss naturally or because when we cast it the player moves out of range easily enough. a range boost to our skills would be nice...instead of 80, 100 would be better. rogues...i heard their rebirth skill is useless because the targets can skill move after they use it and its a skill that works only of they are in range...so they swing at the air for like 5 seconds. i don't have a rogue so i can't verify this sadly...but i am working on one just not close to rebirth yet.

-in the end-

every class has something that is broken. the way it looks its either something that's an easy fix or is just a programming limit of a real time flash game mmo. I personally would like to see priests get skills changes to provide me more of a reason to better myself to try to conquer all my foes. i'd like mage skills to be looked at a little more to see if their skill is truly broken. it would be nice to know how armor pen, crit defense and pen resistance actually work, is it a defense ignore type pvp skill? is it some other type of formula to affect how it works? is it a sengolia only stat? and the range issue for failed skills on knights and rogues make a serious issue to the potential we have...as hooking will almost always be useless if the person has enough movespeed to escape a stun and that leaves us sitting ducks for 15 seconds on a level 5 hook (mages can usually blink out then spam skills to kill us at this point). Oh...speaking of blink, 8 seconds cool down and removes rooting, so mages can blink to avoid any roots and possibly ruin any skills cast on them...allowing them enough time to land off some instant casts to win the match against them. Ranger is the only class i don't know much about...didn't like them when i first tried a ranger. o.o


Yes this is way off topic from the title, but this has developed into a multi-class discussion.

[Alexmancer]

Im a non casher ( for the most part.. only pets i have spend money on ) lvl 100 scion priest.. hyrbid... the reason i am not blood is because the blood skills practically hold no power. And this was never a thread against a mage. But since you keep bringing it up.. it is impossible for my character.. on a Hellwing... with 788 soul.. to fight a mage that can stun and crit me for 100k +. One hit dead. And im not weak either.

Same reason I'm not full blood. I've been considering going back, but Angel's Blessing is much more helpful.

And kim is right. I'm not far behinmd her on either matk or soul, and I've seen mages crit me that hard too, and I myself am close to 100k hp. My crit only does about 60k at it's very best and I have 14.5k matk (this is with master blood beam). Mages hit really hard.



@ the continued discussion on int vs end for bood priests, we did this math back in September on Aurora Point before any other servers were available to play one. you LOSE damage going full end.

[ShadowGammaDraco]

Im a non casher ( for the most part.. only pets i have spend money on ) lvl 100 scion priest.. hyrbid... the reason i am not blood is because the blood skills practically hold no power. And this was never a thread against a mage. But since you keep bringing it up.. it is impossible for my character.. on a Hellwing... with 788 soul.. to fight a mage that can stun and crit me for 100k +. One hit dead. And im not weak either.

ya.. its a thread about priest but. priests against the world. so that involves every class. can't rly do that and not have other classes opinions be heard if you guys are trying to actually be fair and make things fair. all ppl wanna do is argue over who is right and who is wrong. because everyone believe they are right. in which i stated we all are in our own ways. =.= this is just running around in circles.
priest lv 100 friend says their tactic is curse run attack, and other priest do similar. but it all really depend on who's using the character . they said preist def is kinda low. and that dmg for blood priest is semi lower then others but attack rate makes up for it. don't believe me? log back into my server and talk to pleasured or Moy a friend of pleasureds
the greatest flaw in every weapon. is the user

I've read the thread, and I don't really see any concrete ideas, just a lot of complaining about not being able to beat a certain player, some complaining about certain stats with some equipment, and a few comparisons to a version that isn't even the original nor does it take into account the overall builds of every class and how each class interacts and balances each other.

I also saw BrotherVT ask for the summarized version of what the idea is, but that was only followed by complaining about how he asked for a summary.

So, it will be asked again- come up with a concrete and balanced idea, explain how it won't affect all the other classes or general gameplay, explain the benefits and the potential negatives, include some ballpark numbers. Make it all nice and neat and we'll pass it along to the GMs to be looked at.

"You're comparing apples and oranges here Holy light isnt even an attack it is a heal over time that is completely worthless right now."
so i basically stated i have a attack spell that does this DoT. and you said you have a heal spell that heals that amount. i'd say that we are even. thats what im saying. if both were used then the effect is null. am i right? seriously whats with all the moot points =.= . you gave a example of what your skill does and i gave a example of a equivalent exchange for mage's dmg skill which was what was requested. and going off previous threads of all these like i said and other ppl said before, an then gm once said on a "can you nerf them they can kill me " thread/ that if any changes happen to the classes it will happen to them all. and since asking for a boost is same thing as asking for a nerf. same rule will most likely apply. this is like the thread about spawn camping where the person said it should be stated spawn camping is a ban'able offense then wondered why there are ppl who spawn camped posting their side of story "changing their thread from the topic". when the topic directly involves and influences them. i'm not saying that i wouldn't wanna see some cool change to priest. i play priests. mainly other classes because i fancy them more. but priests and knights are my #2 &#3 personal fav. like i've said before.....=.=

if they change stuff we are gonna be in the same boat just in a different way. there's always going to be someone who skilled their build to be able to battle your class specifically better. just like there's AM ranger for the bane of everything magic. then we end up here again with threads like these because that person was competition an mostly always won since that class and skill build grants exclusive advantages over the other.

The reason you're dieing is because you going up against priests with easily 4k-5k more attack than you

so take all my other data of just about everything else being on par with them until gmut events came out and they spend 15+platnum to get gtitan then 15-30 more to get gryphon an more cause the types of class they are being able to make more and get stronger. then get even more stronger since now capable of even more.
and you have your answer then on how to improve your char so mages that would generally be a handful would be easy to kill as you say an evidence has proven with my battles. if you saw my seng video you saw how much and how fast i die from every class in various situations. if you don't have advantage node level'd much at all, maxing that would give a definite edge if you could cash. and along the way it would give insane endurance boost, then max motion node for 25% endurance stat boost 100+ to all stat. cast ur rebirth buff and your practically a god or goddess i bet. think there's even a immortality node that gives even more

[MissKimmer]

Im a non casher ( for the most part.. only pets i have spend money on ) lvl 100 scion priest.. hyrbid... the reason i am not blood is because the blood skills practically hold no power. And this was never a thread against a mage. But since you keep bringing it up.. it is impossible for my character.. on a Hellwing... with 788 soul.. to fight a mage that can stun and crit me for 100k +. One hit dead. And im not weak either.

[ShadowGammaDraco]

You're comparing apples and oranges here Holy light isnt even an attack it is a heal over time that is completely worthless right now.

A: Yes the lvl 100 scions who have been playing since the start of the game have no idea what they are talking about, and have no knowledge of other classes skills.
B: Taken from my mage friend this is his hit rate, you shouldn't have any trouble hitting things.


C: The reason you're dieing is because you going up against priests with easily 4k-5k more attack than you, we're talking about same geared lvl 100 scion Priests with 16k-20k attack outside of seng going up against same geared classes with 16k-20k attack outside seng.

Question how do you know about end game scion pvp when you aren't lvl 100 yet even?
I'm not trying to be rude here but you are saying things without having anything to back it up, mages are one of the most over powered classes in the game. Get to lvl 100 get 16k+ attack OUTSIDE of seng then go in seng and see who can actually kill you 1v1, and no you don't have to cash to reach this lvl you just have to put a lot of effort into your character.

14 lvl away. big woop. i said i was about 10 level away from 100. as a non casher thats not gonna make a huge difference for me. what woulda made a big difference is being able to do dungeons like knights rangers and priests. they make the most money and develp the most in game wise without having much RL spent on them. mage, needs backing, and as ppl said before playing alts" takes away from full development" of the main. so how would i be able to develop me char to be ever on par with these classes in a fair way that you guys seem to fear mages potential of being. if i have to do a bunch of stuff to even get somewhat on par with ppl. then during that time my abilitys to gain are hampered because of being easily pvp'd. so i'm supposed to cash hardcore to get a character even functional against other classes in a tiny bit an that is somehow unfair to priests? not everyone is a casher. any dungeon 55+ on a mode higher then normal costs me many orbs. even now. was able to kite zabuga on NM w out any blessed stones or Horb or buff. but that took over a half hour for one boss and endless running. i can't sit here and eat orbs. i've tried buying orbs from the market. that depends on other cashers selling. which, no one really constantly sells Horb an i dun have the money for constantly buying something when the cost of my reward in dungeon will be less of a hassle to get then Horb.because of this game balance. and i stated that the priest and rangers and knights and rogues i was fighting were on par with me or better. and only way i can get more gold badges for better stuff is from day in vidalia or tamalan, tamalan is hard because its all about kill shot and there's a perfect balance. and EVERYONE in this thread comparing apples to oranges and then inter-dimensional space fruit from a galaxy far far away. . so my discussion is valid. i've pvp'd your class all the way till now. and i put ss of my char up comparing against a few priests a few posts back showing as such. i didn't lie or leave out any info. and i have friends who play lv 90-100's. its called having guild mates who talk. =.= . test each other out. have sparring matches so we know how to deal with other ppl from not in guild that there class.

my hit rly doesn't matter against ppl with crazy dodge thats 50% or more. meaning that there's a good chance half my hits are gonna miss. or say deduct 40%(ur firends) from 50% if it worked that way, means i only have a negative10% chance to hit those ppl. those characters can also move so fast because of where they developed soul. they aren't even where i meteored. there is many variables to this. as you seee my hit is only 33%. so . again. i'm not like your friends stat page an none of us play the same way or with the same tactics or during when we feel tired or exhausted or even distracted for a moment can effect how a battle ends up. even slip and press the wrong key can get you killed a lot in battle. same goes for bath. fail a heal an almost whole bath party falls apart.

again. i said it before. only way to do a true comparison would be to have gm's create a bunch of shell characters and run a billion simulations to see if there is any unfairness between classes. but then again there will always be disadvantages and advantages plugged into each class. or what would separate them from each other? if there's one all around hardcore class. what point is there for the others?

[MissKimmer]

As far as intial skill .. like alex was saying..
Holy Light.. the skill that heals like 400 over a period of 12 seconds that no one uses?
Yea that one
It should cast damage reduction as well

[B3lle]

3: Make Holy Light give dmg reduction, and make the healing based off targets % max hp. ~600 hp/2 sec for 6 seconds doesn’t make a difference anymore, we scaled way past it being usefull.
the mirror for that skill would be mages ice blast. does around that dmg as poison dmg (400 as lv 1) for 6-8 sec or w/e after being shot. same situation, end game hitting someone who has 160-200k health , 1-2k DoT doesn't mean squat

You're comparing apples and oranges here Holy light isnt even an attack it is a heal over time that is completely worthless right now.

See thats where your wrong. You obviously don't know the classes your comparing. My hits only do 10k-30k IF IF IF i crit...Especially when we are factoring the main convo being lvl 100's fighting each other. Dude. My metoer has NO EFFECT on knights rangers and rogues most the time. Wanna know why? High end rogues can get a skill which purges negative effects constantly every few second. The rest have forgiveness etc etc or such high dodge it doesn't even touch them.

A: Yes the lvl 100 scions who have been playing since the start of the game have no idea what they are talking about, and have no knowledge of other classes skills.
B: Taken from my mage friend this is his hit rate, you shouldn't have any trouble hitting things.


C: The reason you're dieing is because you going up against priests with easily 4k-5k more attack than you, we're talking about same geared lvl 100 scion Priests with 16k-20k attack outside of seng going up against same geared classes with 16k-20k attack outside seng.

Question how do you know about end game scion pvp when you aren't lvl 100 yet even?
I'm not trying to be rude here but you are saying things without having anything to back it up, mages are one of the most over powered classes in the game. Get to lvl 100 get 16k+ attack OUTSIDE of seng then go in seng and see who can actually kill you 1v1, and no you don't have to cash to reach this lvl you just have to put a lot of effort into your character.

We've given a summarized version of what we would like changed in pages 17~19, any GM is free to go back to those pages and look at our suggestions.

[venomeh]

lol peeping my char? have bear because all my other pets are dead from dungeons or fighting other ppl or are out of life. i have a SA and a teeka, my fragarach orb is giving me more attack then gold slayer orb cause i couldn't farm enough honor or do gr's much succesfully since getting ***** in gr since day 1 almost. starting off i had to pay 15g a day in repairs to do gr's because fighting priests 1vs1 rangers 1vs 1 knights 1 vs 1 that like to randomly atk then keep attacking specifically you. i'm not a cash player. don't have gems but i still have around 10k matk when in battle w deep freeze. and this is exactly what i was describing earlier. not everyone was built the same. not everyones battles end the same. the ppl i'm fighting have always been par level or higher. and par stuff or better if they are cashers. alll of our comparison data is going to be skewed by who spent what where etc etc then how those unique algorithms play out in each battle which each battle will not be the same as another. so we are all somewhat right and wrong in our own ways. is basically what i've been saying

yeah I checked it out to see why you're saying that priests can kill you easily.. and I meaned your mount, not pets.