remove this Lovely Wonderful ? def rune from game or give to knights too

[Zorich]

There's an easy way to balance guardian rune, make purge rune upgradable to advance and each level remove a % of guardian rune, maxed remove guardian fully.

This was mentioned a looong time ago when adv runes came out.

If Purge Adv Rune dispelled "undispellable" effects like Brutality, Guardian, Medusa Brutality and Triton Shield starting at 20% and up to 100% effectiveness at max level, it would be desirable.

If Puri Adv Rune was immune to Chaos effect and had a 20% to 100% (at max) chance to give a 2-round "Bubble" of debuff protection it'd be a Group PvP Mainstay as an Amnesia / Chaos shield.

No one would be complaining about the Guardian Rune were these implemented.

[Zorich]

So many ******** on this thread, at least if you post get your fact straight, don't talk about passive/talent knight don't have, don't compare a 30% damage red to a 70% that can be used while on pet, just admit that advanced guardian rune is op, also why do archer get it? They already have is and same hp passive as knight, why would archer get another 70% damage red? Anyway everything will be even when knight block heal will be unnerfed, hopefully soon.

It will never go back to the way it was.

There is a chance that it will be revised though. I'd suggested the heal-cap on Block-Heal be a factor of one's Block #. If Block-Heal were capped at 3000 + 33% of one's Block Statistic, with all L12 Block Gems, L10 Holy Enshieldment and all the Dragon Soul bonuses, one's Block can go over 30k. That'd be a 13k+ Heal Cap for someone who wants to build towards it. I think that's more reasonable.

A straight 4% Heal scales too quickly. You'd be talking the high-end Knights healing 30k HP per block right now. Now I know you'd immediately say, "Well, that's what Sunto is healing on high end Mages." And there you'd be right. But Block Heals are automatic, non-cast, immediate, non counterable and often occur multiple times per round from Troops.

Before the cap was in place, I'd fight knights that I couldn't get off max HP because they'd run no troops, they'd lead with HS just to ping me, then ultimate (targeting my lowest hp% in back row), then bubble, then ultimate, then apollo, then ultimate, etc.. They'd never hit the troops on purpose because they were healing 10k+ HP per block (way back when), usually 2 of them per round. I remember posting some time ago regarding this that equal BR knights were block-healing over 120k HP before the 50% mark when my Resto was only doing about 65k Healing - so their "free" heals were doing about the same that my 70 Rage and 2 Lost Actions were doing for me.

No, Knight Block-Heals will never return to the way they were, nor should they.

[Zorich]

as far as I know chaos and amnesia can be puri'd and what u said abt Knight have a talent that increases block rate , knight dont have it. There's a talent abt block but not to increase block rate, but a chance to deflect xx% damage with succesfully block , cmiiw

Chaos and Amnesia can be puri'd - but it's tricky.

Chaos cannot be puri'd by the person with the Chaos on them. If you use the Puri Rune or are a Mage casting Puri, you will not affect yourself, though you have a chance to affect your teammates in group PvP. I personally think the code on this is messed up - but it is what it is. You can not clear Chaos from yourself.

Amnesia can only be puri'd if you still have puri available. Good luck on that. . A L10 Amnesia can be utterly devastating when it gets the right skills. Especially when a Knight combines it with Intercept and Shadow Thrasher. You can make a player sit there default attacking for the equivalent of 6 rounds.

And I actually encountered a Knight that did that just yesterday and had, of all pets, a Medusa that used "Steal" 1st move to prevent me from awakening to get out of my Amnesia state. He timed his Intercept to me using Thunderer, triggered Amnesia right after, then Thrashered to Slow me and Awakened. I still took him cause I had a ton of BR on him - but it's the first time a Knight that was almost half my BR took me well past 50% in BG. Kudos to that strategy.

If he was anywhere near my BR I'd have lost that handily.

[kattuktk]

I remember making a thread complaining about the unfair guardian rune when it was introduced and all the " pro knights" (aka mindless cashers)were bashing me. I'm so glad to see them complain now

[R238423534]

The true unfairness is in ADVANCED RUNES. Only Brutality, Blood, Healing and Guardian runes can be advanced, which means archer and mage can have 4 advanced runes while knight can only have 3. Do we see the unbalance in runes? Yes.

As for skill duplication, everyone can equip Mire rune. Sure, everyone has a slowing skill, but the mage skill doesn't have a 100% chance and it costs 50 rage, and knight can't use it until after Class Advancement (isn't that a bit too late?). Although the archer skill has the longest CD time, the debuff lasts for 4 turns with QTE, so the extra turn somewhat offsets the longer CD time.

Each class had one skill rune they were disqualified from using, sadly in the case of mages it was purification which is truly a class definer as opposed to healing. Knights already have two shields.. and Archers do not get the Purge runestone which duplicates scatter shot. I know it seems incredibly unfair.. but as of now we know of no changes being made to the system.. though as a fellow battle ground player, I hate that guardian rune myself.. makes me bat nuts

[R238423534]

Basically, only numeric or percentage runes can be advanced; buff & debuf runes cannot. It's unfortunate that Guardian rune is a percentage rune while neither purge nor puri is. The worse thing is that now positive buffs added by runes (Brutality & Guardian) cannot be expelled while negative buffs added by runes (Blood, Chaos, Amnesia, Mire) can be expelled, which means purge & scatter can't remove the positive buffs while puri (rune or skill) can remove the debuffs. A bit of an obvious unbalance I could see.

It could be in part that guardian rune can be advanced but the purge and purification runes can not. The guardian rune is the bane of any players existence because they can't be removed where as the shields of a knight can and I wish that would be taken into consideration.. at least then it would level the playing field in a slight way. For what the future may bring I don't know.. I wish I did... but all I do know is.. I wish I could make the field a little more even for you, but sadly I am unable to.

[R238423534]

Ever since who-knows-when, I abandoned Apollo Shield & just bubble up & finish fast ;D

Not that AS is useless, but I mainly focus on PvE, which is basically a dps & speed race, so can't shield too often. For group runs, AS is not as good as IS any ways so I don't use it unless there's no archer on team.

Huh? There's exactly one other rune that might be subject to purge, and it's also immune (brutality). The ones that affect other players can be puri'd of course, but that's pretty different. It wouldn't make much difference if you could purge it though, you'd have to be psychic to have good enough timing to clear it with 2 rounds left, so you're normally only going to wipe the buff for one round. Only going to help if you're low on awakening points and have to use delphic right away, or not at all.

And of course it's ridiculous that the guardian rune can be advanced, but there's just no way they can reverse that (incredibly stupid) decision at this point. I don't see any realistic options to balance it either. But I regularly throw up apollo shield right before going into sylph, which gives me 2-3 rounds of 30% reduction, which isn't bad. Not as good as 2 rounds of 52-70% when you can time it to ensure the other person's delphic is blunted, though.

[R238423534]

Rune doesn't cost a full turn to cast.

LOL never even noticed that but then again who is gonna waste a skill/turn/rune to purge brut anyway lol

[Tranc3motion]

Rune doesn't cost a full turn to cast.

Runes don't last for a ridiculous number of turns either.

[R238423534]

Steal only keeps you in sylph mode and the opponent out of sylph mode. If your hero is relatively strong but your sylph is much weaker (quite common for non-cashers started before 2013), it doesn't help as much. But I agree it can intercept a sylph delphic. That's the sylph version of Intercept plus Rage rune. Too powerful in group 4v4.

alway makes me laugh with these threads currently on my archer i can run at anyone with a wind sylph whilst using my hurc ( got hit by my own in game wife due to caose in arenas so no its pritt y much anyone) and dont even need guardian rune to live through a steal which is the hardest hitting ability most ive been hit for is 85k all due to insane wind resistance ( with hurc on sat at 1010 wind res ) yes i have an advanced lvl 4 guardian rune that i can throw on at any time to take even less damage but with dimentions they throw a big difference .

now from the other side ive atacked players on east coast with insane electro resistance ( even knights ) and hit them for 6k with my delphic due to resistances ( knight was the one i hit this weak so i no it wasnt guardian rune)

to kinda show its not a weak hit unballened avrage hit on wb is 1.5million with delphic

[R238423534]

The solution is 'easy'. Trick them into casting the rune by a hero delphic, and then sylph up & delphic them after their rune is over. If they are lagging bad enough they can't cast it again before your 10 second sylph delphic CD is over. LOL But yea...if they Steal then you might lose the sylph delphic. That's why I always have 2 delphics on the sylph, with one of them don't consume sylph awakening points.

My archer and mage both lost 200-400 honor per defeat in bg, that's why now they don't run out of camp at all. The knight is luckier. She's my first character so I kept her VIP :P Thinking back, I should have used the balens on the cute little archer instead but whatever. lol

damm this game stupid with this def rune ................
im 533k BR and i got me *** kicked again by a mage with 428k BR
all becouse he go before sylph up to full heall and when i try use delphic he use fast def rune.....
all the time same stupid situation......
since if i dont loose 200 honor each dead i was no care but when u loose 200 honor in every death its not that easy......
its unseless if we talk here all day about this situation and R2 no care about uss better way quit game...
im really desapoint

[R238423534]

You can always knock off their puri rune with an amnesia rune so that they can't puri lol

Knights have no passive or active skill to boost their block. Knights receive no extra block that other classes do not. Knights simply had better incentive to build their block due to block heal passive. Now that the passive is nerfed, block has become a little less popular. Some continue to invest in block because it can help you in places like sky trail, where def is useless and resistance is needed. Others prefer to keep their build heavier on defense to better tank hits from sylphed opponents.

I can say that well built knights near my BR tank as much without guardian rune as I do with guardian rune.

It does seem unfair to me that knights are denied the use of a rune that is so useful both in PvP and PvE. If it makes them feel any better, I've seen that puri rune can do one thing that mage puri can't do: remove chaos from self. Mages are denied use of the puri rune, leaving us with no ability to remove chaos from ourselves (Note: advanced talent for Mana shield states it gives a chance to remove a random debuff from player; I haven't invested in that talent yet and haven't been able to test it. This might give mages a highly luck based chance to remove chaos from themselves).

[R238423534]

With regard to RES, I feel like nowadays everyone has uber electro, dark and light RES, and water is also very popular, it sort of leaves some weaker RES against players with the wind and fire sylphs. I didn't invest in wind and fire to begin with, but now consider revisiting them as they are the ones most players don't have RES against. Not sure if they are worth investing though.

First off here is a lesson for you GET higher resistance crystals. Archers dont heal like mages. Mages are the op class heals damage etc.

Now as someone who has played every class. As a knight if your crying about a Guardian Rune that's kinda of sad especially with a shield that is a bonus 30% to your max hp which unless your an unskilled player an have 50k br an level 80 then Argoans Shield can be op sure it be purged by mages an knights an scatter shotted by an archer. Same with apollo's sheild an again Apollo's is like a guardian rune Oh an dont forget your passive Tenacity reduce damage received by % an reduce crit damage received by %. My main toon now is a 356k br Archer Main sylph is 3 star Purple Athena. Now I will say this PvP to run scatter shot is waste of rage an damage for a turn. If it healed me then wonderful but I am not a mage I get a pretty lame heal as do knights.
With that being said if your having a problem with Guardian Rune then Maybe you need to Focus an get a high level advanced Heal rune. But the big reason you dont do damage is probably the lack there of Will crystals an resistance Crystals. As well as defense an hp.
Archer have one of the hardest times to build def we have damage an then nerfed it just like Knights block heals where mages are still the same "Oh Herro Remember me Yes I am still OP" but lets face it the day then hit mages with the nerf bat the casher community will decrease in numbers by alot. So my suggestion is build hire res Electro, Dark and Light since thats what you see in battlegrounds 99.99% of the time Dont blame the rune blame the skill used to win

[R238423534]

Can you plz tell me which knight talent that is?

http://wartune.wikia.com/wiki/Talents

Don't tell me that it is Persistence. That's the only talent with the word "block" in the description text. It does not increase block rate. It is only a chance to proc deflection when block happens. Your Deflection astral is way better than it.

Knight have a talent that increases block rate

[R238423534]

I just found it funny when archers & mages expect knights to tank while they have much better damage reduction & an extra rune to use, plus the healing skills that are entirely absent on knights (not counting passives & runes). They should stand up front and let us stand back & just hit ;D

OMHO, most knight skills are basically useless because they either do too little things for too much rage and/or CD is too long for them to be useful. I guess we are just the class based much more on stats than skills. On every server where I had been on, the top free player (by BR) is never a knight. That's why I had never tried to build a knight with zero cash invested. I could be wrong, but that's what I saw and believed. I didn't try to compare cashers because cashing level makes much more difference than class and method, and it's not possible to find out how much each player has spent on their character. The free players, however, all cash at the same level (all zero cash in). Their comparison could somewhat tells the true difference between classes.

So many ******** on this thread, at least if you post get your fact straight, don't talk about passive/talent knight don't have, don't compare a 30% damage red to a 70% that can be used while on pet, just admit that advanced guardian rune is op, also why do archer get it? They already have is and same hp passive as knight, why would archer get another 70% damage red? Anyway everything will be even when knight block heal will be unnerfed, hopefully soon.