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[FAQ] Tenets System Finally Exposed

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  • BrotherVT
    started a topic [FAQ] Tenets System Finally Exposed

    [FAQ] Tenets System Finally Exposed

    You thought it was bad back then?! Look at this now!

    This FAQ will address the following questions. You should all be aware of the basic description which is provided in the Tenet System interface. I'll put it here though just in case.
    Click image for larger version

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    I. How many tenet levels are there and how much wisdom is needed?
    II. What are the stats provided at the end of each tenet level?
    III. How many Pearls of Wisdom did you use? [In this case, I will only be using Greater Pearls of Wisdom to confirm the usage amount WITHOUT the Gift Packs involved.]
    IV. Profit
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I. Tenet Names & Levels Note: Each Tenet requires that EXACT amount of wisdom required to max. It doesn't go off the previous amount.
    I.I. Magic Tenet - 7,485 Wisdom to max [ WTM ]
    I.II. Element Tenet - 17,480 WTM
    I.III. Nature Tenet - 27,775 WTM
    I.IV. Mortal Tenet - 38,810 WTM
    I.V. Spirit Tenet - 54,220 WTM
    I.VI. Regal Tenet - 64.970 WTM
    I.VII. Oracle Tenet - 79,970 WTM
    I.VIII. Sage Tenet - 96,655 WTM
    I.IX. Demon Tenet - 118,585 WTM
    I.X. Holy Tenet - 151,725 WTM
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    II. Stats of Each Tenet

    Magic Tenet | Element Tenet | Nature Tenet | Mortal Tenet | Spirit Tenet | Regal Tenet | Oracle Tenet | Sage Tenet | Demon Tenet | Holy Tenet

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    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    III. Amount of Greater Pearls of Wisdom Used

    Well, I hate to say just how expensive this system is because this is just a slap to all non-cashers in the face.
    This cost an estimated exact value of...
    329 Greater Pearls of Wisdom - which is equivalent to $3,691
    Don't you just love us?
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    IV. Profit

    During times such as this full of epicness?!?!?!?!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
    Last edited by BrotherVT; 12-09-2013, 05:24 AM.

  • R2109499284
    replied
    Originally posted by huangdi View Post
    I think if you are kind enough to try this out, you would agree with me.

    Let's say just for a moment that you are correct. How do you explain the extra stat you get from completing each set of five, then? Is that a glitch?

    Lastly, I just want to say this. Scroll back to post #86. Clearly the HP says +170226. That is 170k, not 1.7m. This should cut some of the people you are mentioning down to size, and should make more sense to you. Good day.
    Well, now with the new tenet I had a chance to try this out as I promised I would do. Turns out that my previous statement stays true after testing it. The stats aside from strenght etc. are not affected by %-boni at all. The point in the tenet gives me 1362 attack which if multiplied with my % boni should give me several tenthousand attack. That´s not the case.
    If you however hover over the completed blue circles you will see that the stats in said circle are higher than the stats that were written down in the non completed circles (the one at the bottom of the system which explains the extra set you get when completing a set of five which is in fact intended and not a bug.
    In my specific case the normal circle would give me 1466 attack (as can be seen in the post of maria above this one) while the completion gives 1907 attack which is also not multiplied by % boni as my attack once again did not go up adequately for that.

    You are also not entirely correct on the part with a maxed soul doubling the base stats (strenght, end etc.). While it´s true that the soul alone doubles these the simulacrum also affects these stats with it´s % bonus meaning that a decent level on a simulacrum will give you more than a 100% bonus which I was also able to confirm during the tests with my tenets as finishing all 5 points gave me another extra 130 strenght (on top of the 325 I already got beforehand so 455 in total) which should translate to 260 strenght. I did however gain more strenght than that which only leaves simulacrum.
    The simulacrum also does not affect raw stats (e.g. tenets, chi etc.) as I did test that beforehand when we got the new chi.

    Leave a comment:


  • maria145shigure
    replied
    Originally posted by coreyriding View Post
    no one has posted about the new tenets yet, oof
    you can see it.
    have fun!!
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  • coreyriding
    replied
    no one has posted about the new tenets yet, oof

    Leave a comment:


  • R2109499284
    replied
    Originally posted by huangdi View Post

    You are mistaken. You think a 3000% bonus to HP would be 54.5m, and yes, normally I would agree with you. But a lot of bonuses in the game are additive, not multiplicative

    Lastly, I just want to say this. Scroll back to post #86. Clearly the HP says +170226. That is 170k, not 1.7m. This should cut some of the people you are mentioning down to size, and should make more sense to you. Good day.
    Well no excuse there on the HP part, that is just me straight up making a mistake which lead to a wrong assumption (I am deeply sorry for my offensive wording on the first post). And yes, cutting down the HP by that much makes the stats make more sense if they are acutally affected by %.
    Second: That 3000% boost is based on additive scaling, not multiplicative. If I used multiplicative scalings I would get into the 100 000% or even million % range really quickly.

    Originally posted by huangdi View Post
    I think if you are kind enough to try this out, you would agree with me. That is, after just clicking the fourth circle, you will get only get the stat as stated in the circle, but after finishing the set of five, they will be multiplied by soul. This is not a point of contention, but what happens to the stats in the first three circles are. That is the crux.
    Both toons I play have fully maxed tenets - I will however ask a friend of mine to write down the stats for me so I can check that.

    Leave a comment:


  • huangdi
    replied
    Originally posted by R2109499284 View Post

    Well, you are.



    No they are not multiplied with your %-boosts after completing a circuit. A maxed tenet gives you 1,7 million HP (+another 114k from endurance) which would be the equivalent of 54,5 million HP for a player with a 3000% bonus to HP - at that point you should notice that the math doesn´t work out if we also take divine soul, normal gear, banners,wings, monster handbook, runes, soul cultivation etc. into consideration (for reference, a maxed helmet + armor from the tank set gives over 1,8 million base HP) and I doubt that you want to tell me that that some of the top players get 33-50% of their HP just from tenets.
    What you are experiencing is the small increase in the stats you get whenever you complete a circuit which does NOT mean that the stats are suddenly affected by your %-bonus.
    You are mistaken. You think a 3000% bonus to HP would be 54.5m, and yes, normally I would agree with you. But a lot of bonuses in the game are additive, not multiplicative, and even more bonuses I would love for you to answer (2x exp from guild, Seignior, zodiac does not yield 6x or 8x exp, you tell me why). You will notice that in soul if you max all the agility souls, you will only at any one point be given 2 points per point agility, not 2.32 as would have been produced (0.58+0.21+0.21 on top of your base 100% = 2, not 1.58*1.21*1.21, which would be something like 2.32).

    As for your assertion that I am telling you that some players get 33-50% of their HP from tenets, you are wrong. Nowhere did I say this was the case, but I also did not say this cannot be true–the truth of the matter is, I have no idea. I simply said that in the simplified case where you expect some 2x boost (i.e. the aggregate bonus from, I dunno, pixie, mount, soul, etc.), then you will get it, just not until you finish clicking the five circles.

    For the sake of simplicity once again, we will focus on the last two circles for each level of a tenet (what I am calling the 'circuit'). I have maxed soul, which means that for every point of attribute I get, I should get double (i.e. 1 point agility from a fruit would give me 2 points agility). I am on archaic lvl 7, and the fourth circle (+str, +agility) says +320 str, +36 agility. When I click this button, my strength and agility will go up by +320 and +36, respectively, as the circles say. However, after I click the last circle (+320 int, +50 endurance), then my stats will increase again by another +320 str, +36, as will my intellect and endurance, so when the five circles are complete, I should have +640 str, +72 agility, +640 intellect, +100 endurance total compared to my having clicked on any of the circles on this level. I think if you are kind enough to try this out, you would agree with me. That is, after just clicking the fourth circle, you will get only get the stat as stated in the circle, but after finishing the set of five, they will be multiplied by soul. This is not a point of contention, but what happens to the stats in the first three circles are. That is the crux.

    Let's say just for a moment that you are correct. How do you explain the extra stat you get from completing each set of five, then? Is that a glitch?

    Lastly, I just want to say this. Scroll back to post #86. Clearly the HP says +170226. That is 170k, not 1.7m. This should cut some of the people you are mentioning down to size, and should make more sense to you. Good day.
    Last edited by huangdi; 08-20-2020, 11:16 AM.

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  • R2109499284
    replied
    Originally posted by huangdi View Post

    No one is incorrect here
    Well, you are.

    Originally posted by huangdi View Post

    The stats are only multiplied by soul or pixie after you complete the circuit–that is, after the five circles of each set are completed.
    No they are not multiplied with your %-boosts after completing a circuit. A maxed tenet gives you 1,7 million HP (+another 114k from endurance) which would be the equivalent of 54,5 million HP for a player with a 3000% bonus to HP - at that point you should notice that the math doesn´t work out if we also take divine soul, normal gear, banners,wings, monster handbook, runes, soul cultivation etc. into consideration (for reference, a maxed helmet + armor from the tank set gives over 1,8 million base HP) and I doubt that you want to tell me that that some of the top players get 33-50% of their HP just from tenets.
    What you are experiencing is the small increase in the stats you get whenever you complete a circuit which does NOT mean that the stats are suddenly affected by your %-bonus.

    Leave a comment:


  • huangdi
    replied
    Originally posted by millinium1 View Post
    Just confused with tenets stats. As i observe when i upgrade, the attack and defense stats was not multiplied by multiplier (mount, pixie, soul etc..) but attributes like int and str do. Is this a bug or was it really how the system works. Thanks
    No one is incorrect here. The stats are only multiplied by soul or pixie after you complete the circuit–that is, after the five circles of each set are completed. For example, if you expect a 2x boost, it says +1000 hp, when you click the first circle, it will just give +1000 hp. However, when you are done clicking all the circles for that level (i.e. the one that generally ends with +end and +int), then you will get your +2000 hp, as expected. This extends to the attributes as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • *Minori*
    replied
    Originally posted by millinium1 View Post

    Thanks for the fast response Minori-san. Good day.
    You're welcome! Happy gaming!

    Leave a comment:


  • millinium1
    replied
    Originally posted by *Minori* View Post

    The system is not bugged. It's working as intended. The only stats that are intended to multiply from the tenets system are Strength, Endurance, Agility, and Intellect.
    Thanks for the fast response Minori-san. Good day.

    Leave a comment:


  • *Minori*
    replied
    Originally posted by millinium1 View Post
    Just confused with tenets stats. As i observe when i upgrade, the attack and defense stats was not multiplied by multiplier (mount, pixie, soul etc..) but attributes like int and str do. Is this a bug or was it really how the system works. Thanks
    The system is not bugged. It's working as intended. The only stats that are intended to multiply from the tenets system are Strength, Endurance, Agility, and Intellect.

    Leave a comment:


  • millinium1
    replied
    Just confused with tenets stats. As i observe when i upgrade, the attack and defense stats was not multiplied by multiplier (mount, pixie, soul etc..) but attributes like int and str do. Is this a bug or was it really how the system works. Thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • *Minori*
    replied
    Originally posted by R242811489 View Post
    Can anyone total the wisdom and bloodgems needed for antique, archaic, and Cambria? I tried to formulate all the needed wisdom and bloodgems but I got confused
    The total amounts are posted on page 6 by myself, xPrototypeT, and Reinviting. There's a total at the bottom of each post giving the amount of total wisdom and Antique Bloodgems required.

    Leave a comment:


  • R242811489
    replied
    Can anyone total the wisdom and bloodgems needed for antique, archaic, and Cambria? I tried to formulate all the needed wisdom and bloodgems but I got confused

    Leave a comment:


  • *Minori*
    replied
    Originally posted by R2109499284 View Post


    Thank you for collecting and sharing the requirements for the Cambria Tenet Minori.
    I'm happy to help.

    Leave a comment:

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