Priest should change!

[Psyc80]

I won't bother checking out the other game.. but I have to agree.. I have to grow twice as much as a priest in order to match any other competitor I am against.. I face a Knight equal to my stat and its a toss up as to the results.. because I have myself built as a Hybrid Tanker healer and Support DPS.. I can solo ladder myself to 39.. add some more dps and we can reach 49.. with minimal effort.. if I hadn't been playing a priest for about the last 15 years on multiple other games.. i'd have probably changed by now.. but its simply a comfort exchange for me..

Since a Priest is designed to survive and help others survive.. in a PVP environment wouldn't it make sense that our strengths make us a Tougher Opponent??

Get to the point people hate fighting priests because they Heal SO MUCH and So fast that they can barely keep the damage up because the priest slowly grinds them down? I mean the rogue stuns and hits so fast its hard to get them before they take you Down if they are fast enough - not the damage, only the speed stands out here. This has been my experiences in PVP..

My Priest:

Priest Versus a Knight - If they are a DPS knight they have a tendency to overpower me if they are 2500 less to my attack or higher, Tanks can soak a lot of damage but tend to out damage me if they can get close enough easily.. the amount of heals I can do don't even compare to the damage flying at me. Example: (12500 vs my 15000)

Priest Versus Mage - Distance Plus Massive Damage and Possibilities of Crit.. usually eliminates me if they are 5000 attack less then my priest or higher.. which feels excessive that they can Do twice my damage with almost half the attack power... ehh?? Example: (10000 vs my 15000)

Priest Versus Ranger - Again Distance Plus EXTREME bonuses to their critical, but they have to be within 2500 less my attack of mine or higher in order to eliminate me, and can do it fairly quickly because of the high crit most times.. even with a higher gen of damage reductions. Example: (12500 vs my 15000)

Priest Versus Rogue - This one is ridiculous half the time the vanish with the speed and ability to stun have over powered a fight with a rogue.. unless I avoid their stun I am usually dead regardless of their attacks because of their dodge.. crit and attack speeds.. similar to a mage.. depends on their Build as well.. can be as far down as HALF my attack and able to beat me if they are fast enough.. Example: (7500 vs my 15000)

Priest Versus Priest - This always appears to be on a case by case basis depending on what they are built as and their attack power.. someone of equal standing usually looks like two 5 year old's trying to see who can hit the hardest on a punching bag without the bag even showing notice of the kid touching it. For Me its fairly equal in these fights depending on the higher curse bonuses and the attack power coupled with critical and healing abilities.. who can work the buttons faster in the better combination. With the example provided this can sometimes lead to a very long fight.. usually giving others time to reach the priest and help out Example: (15000 vs my 15000)

These are statistics based on Sengolia where it tries to balance everyone's power out based on their current stats.. has anyone else met with similar settings?

[Psyc80]

LMAO! I am sorry but priests are squishy in 9 out of 10 games anyways. Priest's got mad heal's why they need to be best at all area's? Sorry but i disagree to this suggestion. You make one class all around perfect no other class will be played. Each have there strengths and weakness's that's just how it is. It's meant to be played at a team in this fashion.

By the way Chiefy.. you must be inexperienced with some games, not to be offensive, because Priests are not always the low end. One example I encountered myself was - World of Warcraft, in a Very Aggravating setting made some priests in a certain build such a hassle to fight because of their abilities to fear stun and DoT you up that you were screwed regardless of your build because they could keep their distance and heal while slowly crushing you or even making you walk off a Cliff to Die. (Mind Control)

I'd say your scale rating was off.. but it is about a 6/10 game basis that priests are simply squishier because they are a support role. Mad heal as you say is definitely incorrect in this particular game, it even feels a little on the diminished side when we are spamming out 30k heals in less then a second when the tank is taking 1 shot kill strikes with a 50% reduction in less time then our heals can go off.. in the Crystal Ladder environment the team basis does take precedence, but Sengolia is more of an everyone for themselves fight half the time because they all just drone through try to kill people for silver badges but eventually coalesce on to the crystal to end the event. There is nothing perfect about our requests for the priest.. its simply a desire to be able to achieve with a class we Favor versus the other ones.. Strength's and Weaknesses usually have a more balancing state to them.. in this case being able to out heal but unable to damage in that time frame about 10% of the time isn't even close to a balance, regardless of what buffs can give.. then with the buffs.. The buff ability is great but again.. being able to buff is far outweighed by the fact that we have to get twice the stats to really stand a chance in PVP.. and the buffs do not always provide that extra Boost needed.. we are simply akin to walking Paper Targets.

[nubheals]

My experience in Seng is like this:

Priest vs Knight: zero chance of winning if the knight has hook/stun and know what he is doing. Will be worse now with that invulnerable skill, they can use it to wait for your GE to wears off and kill you easily. And it has 30s cooldown compared to GE's 60s.

Priest vs Ranger: get hit by Silencing strike is the end for us, unless you can avoid getting silenced by Silencing strike then you have a chance. And this chance pretty much depends on whether you can crit or not, because without crit you can't kill off the ranger fast enough with his Bar skin on. It is worse now with the eidolon passive invulnerable every 7s: 2s invulnerable followed by 5s bar skin followed again by 2s invulnerable...

Priest vs Mage and Rogue: they tend to die in 1 hit if you can crit them. However most of the time both of them will initiate the fight with stun. You won't know if a rogue is coming or not, so it is not easy to avoid this. However you can avoid mage's meteor by putting on GE as soon as you see them, which is easily countered by the mage by blinking away and wait for meteor to cooldown to finish you off (24s meteor compared to 60s GE). For both classes, they can easily kill a priest with twice their stats due to long-duration stun.

Priest vs Priest: given equal stats, whoever can pull off a crit light beam first will win, no need for curses (I tried dueling my priest friends many times already)

However, it is worth noting that, as many non-priest players have said, holy priest is meant for support and not DPS, so the above is expected. Also, for all classes, stun/silence/hook is equal dead, not just for priests alone. What I'm sad about is that we can't really support in pvp with heal, as no heal is enough to save you from a string of 100k crit in seconds, and the fact that eidolon heal is just lame in practice (yeah it sounds good on theory only), and the uselessness of blood rebirth skill.

And while most games make it so that the lack of offensive power in priests is made up by high survivability + good support skills, CS just failed to do both. They gave us the worst offensive ability on holy side (expected for a support class), but still make us damn squishy and void half of our support in pvp by making heal inferior to all types of attacks.

[Zatemo]

Since the mods want us to suggest and not jut complain and argue, here are some suggestions for Eidolon Scion skills:

Holy Eidolon:
Places a totem or a huge ring (radius same as holy water from bath) that does the same or slightly more heals as the current eidolon skill every 2 sec. And ally players within the radius of this can not attack or be attacked (includes debuffing; also heals them of course), and this status would be removed if they leave the radius. Also this staus cannot be removed by purging nor by knight's buff remover.

Holy scion: It's good, no change needed.

Blood Scion: enemies take % of damge taken and have a high or % HP regen

Blood Eidolon: Long range aoe skill (like balrogs hell, my holy eidolon skill suggestion, etc.) that roots enemies every 2 sec or 1 sec in that radius, and also does high DoT. This could have vampiric effect if wanted.

This will be posted in the other thread so that mods have higher chance of seeing this.

[Alexmancer]

I'm happy to see this thread is still kicking.

[nubheals]

Well I guess I will just try to organize all my thoughts across all the posts into this 1 big suggestion post, so at least if a GM is reading this, he/she will get a good overall view of what I have been complaining/suggesting on. I will focus more on Eidolon skills of priest because scion holy skill is fine and scion blood just needs fixed.

Eidolon Holy skill - Scared Space
What it is currently doing:
- 10s channeling skill
- Looks like it has 20s cooldown instead of 10s as stated
- Does a decent amount of aoe heal (more than circle of healing and healing wave)

Why it is bad as an eidolon skill:
- It heals slower than light heal because most eidolon priests can hit 150% cast speed by the time they hit lvl cap again, and light heal's cast can be reduced by cast speed down to 1s or so, while eidolon heal's channelling nature just ignores the cast speed we have.
- It heals less than light heal on each target, and for PvE, most of the time you just need to heal the tanker. So light heal is better in most cases as it provides a better, faster heal
- The channelling nature of the skill reduces the flexibility of the caster dramatically, because assuming that your tank dies in ladder while you are casting, you will need to either press [esc] or move a bit to cancel the channelling, then target your tank again before casting resu. For light heal you will be already targeting you tank, so the reaction time to cast resu is faster (and in ladder, 1s reaction can mean the difference between life and death)
- The healing interval is totally unreliable. It is said to be healing once every 2s. However I have noticed (and I'm not the only one) that the first heal tick often kicks in too late (3-4s after we start casting), then the interval between the 2 heal ticks can range anywhere from 1-3s. I have sometimes saw the last heal tick appeared after I have finished casting too. Not sure if this is just lag, but it still makes the heal seems unreliable in my opinion, I would stick to circle of healing + healing wave for almost instant effect

My suggestions on how to improve the skill:
1. The "healing" curse:
- It is a ground-targetted aoe that is similar to curses
- Boost the reduction of the allies in the aoe by 3% + 2% * skill lvl (maximum 15% at lvl 6)
- Heals all allies in the aoe by 40% + 10% * skill lvl healing stats every 2s (maximum 100% healing stats at lvl 6)
- Makes it so that only the highest reduction effect takes place (eg. standing in a lvl 1 and lvl 2 "curse" at the same time should only give you 7% reduction from the lvl 2, and not 12%)
- All healing effects should stack just like curses' damage
- "Curse" lasts 10s, cooldown 20s

2. Toggle splash heal:
- A toggle skill similar to saint's strength
- While this skill is toggled on, light heal will have a splash heal radius equals to circle of healing's radius. Circle of healing and healing wave's radii will be doubled. Also receives a bonus healing stat of 2% + 3% * skill lvl (maximum 20% at lvl 6)
- Drains 1% max sp every second until turned off

3. Passive mode:
- Whenever the priest heals, he/she has 4% + 1% * skill lvl chance to trigger a 3s invulnerability on the healed target (maximum 10% chance). In case of an aoe heal, each target has the chance calculated individually
- Whenever the priest gets inflicted with negative statuses, the status will be purged and the priest gains 1s debuff immunity (1s goddess embrace). This passive effect has a cooldown of 33s - 3s * skill lvl (minimum 15s cooldown at lvl 6)

Eidolon Blood skill - Bloody Arces
What it is currently doing:
- Costs 12% hp
- Randomly roots 1 target
- The rooted target can't be attacked
- Last up to 13s, cooldown 30s at all lvl

Why it is bad as an eidolon skill:
- Comparing it to ranger's wither traps or priest's curses, this skill is totally inferior
- Both wither trap and curses cost technically nothing to use (compared to 12% hp)
- Both wither trap and curses are aoe (compared to RANDOM single target)
- Both wither trap and curses allow the target to be attacked (compared to not being able to attack the target)
- Frankly, no blood priest would use this skill because curses are just better. And what is more, curses have other negative effects on your enemy too (-atk, def, movespeed). They also have shorter cooldown and thus can be used easier for kiting.

My suggestions on how to improve the skill:
1. Improved curse:
- It is a ground-targetted aoe that is similar to curses
- Trap all targets in the aoe
- Allows the priest (only the priest, not allies) to attack the targets (including even curses)
- All targets trapped cannot use skills (even passive skills should be disabled)
- Reduce HP cost to 5%
- Duration and cooldown can be kept the same

2. Vampiric arces:
- Still a ground-targetted aoe
- Any ally stands within this aoe will be able to leech hp from their attacks
- Leech ratio is 2% + 3% * skill lvl (maximum 20% leeching at lvl 6). If multiple arces are placed, only the highest leech effect will take place
- Duration is 2s + 1s * skill lvl (maximum of 8s at lvl 6)
- Cooldown is 25s

3. Improved bloodfog totem:
- Behaves similarly to bloodfog totem, however the effect should be invulnerable and heal instead of stealth (only affect caster)
- Totem duration: 20s
- Invulnerability duration: 2s
- Heal amount: 35% + 5% * skill lvl healing stat (maximum 65% healing stat at lvl 6)
- Interval between buffs: 12s - 1s * skill lvl (minimum 6s interval)
- Cooldown: 45s
(Now before any of you say that this is OP, remember that rangers have a PASSIVE invul of 2s every 7s, and it gives goddess embrace's effect during that 2s too)

So yeah, that's all I have in mind for now. Hope the skills will be remade to be more practically useful, even if the remaking doesn't follow my suggestions above

[MissKimmer]

Good to see that this thread is still going. I wish that they would make the blood priest skills work so i could actually use them. Whats the point of demons grasp if youre 1v1ing someone. Or now im hearing that you cant attack either with blood acres? What is that about? Also, why is it that you cant attack with sacred space. Yet now rogues have an instant kill. And ranger knights and mages have immunity for however long. This is the most unbalanced game I have ever played at this point.

[nubheals]

Rogue's instant skill is only 20% chance at max lvl, and it requires a hp lower than 30% to be usable, so that is a bit risk in using that skill there: either your target dies or you do. That skill is actually not too unbalanced when you compare it to 7.5s invul every 30s (knight), 10s invul with full hp regen every 30s (mage) or passive 2s invul + goddess embrace's effect every 7s (ranger).

Rogue's shadow eidolon is still better than instant kill in my opinion, it has a cooldown of around 30s at max lvl, gives 10s of 30% patk boost and can help you restealth even when you are not within melee range (unlike shadow strike)

[fhjkas]

this is sad... makes me rethink about what class i should use...
the mere fact that a complain like this sprang after a year of CS proves that something should be improved. afterall, these concerns are coming from high-level priests who have alloted so much time and have played for how many months to build their character just to find out that they are at a great disadvantage over other classes...

This issue discouraged me from playing priest class... Some may also be discouraged. I just wish that there will still be enough people confident enough to play Priest class even though they know about this great disadvantage... I mean use priest as their main, and not as an alt to give buff and heal in vault lol.

[(S14)Squintina]

this is sad... makes me rethink about what class i should use...
the mere fact that a complain like this sprang after a year of CS proves that something should be improved. afterall, these concerns are coming from high-level priests who have alloted so much time and have played for how many months to build their character just to find out that they are at a great disadvantage over other classes...

This issue discouraged me from playing priest class... Some may also be discouraged. I just wish that there will still be enough people confident enough to play Priest class even though they know about this great disadvantage... I mean use priest as their main, and not as an alt to give buff and heal in vault lol.

There are people who do use priest as their main.
I do and I know plenty of people on my server who do. We may not be the best PVP-wise, but built right we can do wonders in dungeons, training, and ladder. I might say that in dungeons we are many times advantaged over the other classes because of heal.

[MissKimmer]

Okay so. I have just rebirthed for the second time and at first i was very excited about sacred space. Until i realized it was just another useless skill, and yet another skill that doesnt do what it says its going to do. First of all, it says it heals every 2 seconds for a max of 20 seconds. The cast time is only 10 seconds. And it doesnt start healing until 3 seconds in. And it stops casting after 12 seconds. Where is my other 8 seconds of heal it says its supposed to last for. Why is it that once i move it doesnt work anymore. Why cant I move and still be healed. Why doesnt it last for 20 seconds. Oh the questions can just go on and on.

[nubheals]

Sacred space's description of having 20s duration is bugged, it should only last for 10s. This is a known issue and was reported already.

Also the skill is a channelling skill, that means you have to stand in 1 place while casting it. Once you move, the channelling is cancelled which leads to the skill's effect ending prematurely. This channelling at the same time makes your cast speed being useless because no matter how high your cast speed is, the cast will always be fixed at 10s. It is because of this channelling nature that eidolon heal is useless most of the time, and light heal is more preferred.

People who play priests as mains and have rebirthed to eidolon don't just complain about the eidolon skills if there is nothing wrong with them lol. Just the devs refuse to see the flaws that our lvl 200 skills are worse than mortal skills.

[xena6]

This thread has been here for how long now?? priests are so under powered it's ridiculous. The eidolon skills don't even work right for blood or holy. how come knights. mages, rogues and ranger have the advantage? Does R2 even care about priests in this game?? I'm a holy hybrid and I have noticed the new eidolon skill lags it says it lasts 20s but yet I only get 6 heals outta it???? isn't it supposed to be every 2 secs if so shouldn't it be healing 10 x's not 6??? Unless in the description R2 messed up? R2 u really need to balance the priests there are so many other skills that priests use in other games and they are more balanced. Why not go check out some of the other priests in other games and get some decent ideas on how to balance us with other classes. Why don't priests have silence??? It's a support skil or even smite would be a great attack skill for a holy priest.

[nubheals]

xena, our eidolon holy skill heals only 5 times, not 6 xD

[xena6]

well I used it recently and it healed 6 lol